| --- Log opened Thu Aug 28 00:00:29 2014 |
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| 03:02 | | McM[AFK] is now known as McMartin |
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| 04:11 | < Vornotron> | Reiv: did you see my analysis of your dice puzzle? |
| 04:35 | <@Reiv> | Vornotron: Possibly not! |
| 04:42 | < Harlow> | do define statements not need semi colons? |
| 04:43 | < Harlow> | (c language) |
| 04:43 | <&McMartin> | #define exists outside of C, so yeah, don't put semicolons in unless you want semicolons to show up when you substitute. |
| 04:45 | < Harlow> | k |
| 04:46 | <@macdjord> | Harlow: Technically, there are no 'define statements'. There are 'define preprocessor instructions'. And no, they do not need semi-colons in and of themselves, though, if they contain syntactically complete C statements, thos statements will have semicolons. |
| 04:46 | < Harlow> | yeah thats more what i was asking, thanks mac |
| 04:47 | <@macdjord> | Harlow: Defines are terminated by the fist unescaped newline. |
| 04:48 | <&McMartin> | FIST OF NEWLINE |
| 04:50 | < Harlow> | Lol. |
| 04:52 | < Harlow> | Any macros that I should checkout that will make C easier for me? (I come from a land of C++) |
| 05:05 | < Vornotron> | http://www.starforge.co.uk/irclogs/code/code.20140823.log.html#m0616-0 |
| 05:05 | < Vornotron> | at work we're fiddling with this insurance website where you have to go through a bank to get in and the bank in the test server is still called Fist Niagara |
| 05:06 | | Derakon is now known as Derakon[AFK] |
| 05:06 | < Harlow> | Lol |
| 05:07 | <@Reiv> | normsinv ? |
| 05:09 | < Vornotron> | NORMSINV in Excel does: given a probability P, find a z score on a standard normal distribution (mean 1 stdev 0) where a random variable will fall below that z score with probability P. |
| 05:13 | <@Reiv> | oh I see |
| 05:13 | < Vornotron> | The more z scores that show up between, say, -2 and +2, the more easily you can adjust your target score based on how hard things are. |
| 05:15 | < Vornotron> | a d20 is nice because it's got good resolution in that range; this as compared to most success-based systems, where it doesn't take much at all to go from nigh impossible to trivial |
| 05:16 | <@Reiv> | Indeed |
| 05:16 | <@Reiv> | That said, sometimes the resolution could be accused of being a little too granular |
| 05:16 | <@Reiv> | And indeed Numenera throws half of it out accordingly, much to my considerable amusement. |
| 05:17 | | Kindamoody[zZz] is now known as Kindamoody |
| 05:17 | < Vornotron> | This thing is *completely batshit* as far as that goes |
| 05:17 | <@Reiv> | (The difficulty scale defaults to 1-10, target numbers are difficulty x3.) |
| 05:20 | < Vornotron> | but easy-yet-not-quite-trivial tasks are completely missing; it's not possible to have a thing less than 16% likely to fail. |
| 05:20 | <@Reiv> | Yeah, but |
| 05:21 | <@Reiv> | Oh hang on, OK |
| 05:21 | <@Reiv> | The hypothetical situation I was looking at was not 'is this a practical dice system' (heck no, of course not) |
| 05:21 | <@Reiv> | It was "I wonder how this would function, possibly for a turn counter" |
| 05:22 | <@Reiv> | So it's not so much 16% chance of failure, as 16% chance that you'll get one more turn once you start rolling. |
| 05:23 | < Vornotron> | THe wild length variation is probably not what you want. |
| 05:24 | <@Reiv> | It kind of was! |
| 05:25 | <@Reiv> | One bit about the probability curve that gets me, though |
| 05:25 | <@Reiv> | How the hell is anyone rolling a 2? |
| 05:27 | < Vornotron> | they're not |
| 05:27 | | thalass is now known as Thalass|lunchymunchy |
| 05:28 | <@Reiv> | So rolling a 1 is 16%, and rolling a 2 is 0%? Neat. |
| 05:31 | | Reiv_ [NSwebIRC@Nightstar-q8avec.kinect.net.nz] has joined #code |
| 05:31 | < Reiv_> | So rolling a 1 is 16%, and rolling a 2 is 0? Neat. |
| 05:31 | < Vornotron> | yep |
| 05:31 | < Reiv_> | What's a 3? |
| 05:32 | < Reiv_> | I get the feeling things get progressively boosted till 6, then drop off, yes? |
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| 05:37 | < Vornotron> | 3 is 1/36. |
| 05:37 | < Vornotron> | Then it gets easier for a little while, and then harder |
| 05:39 | < Reiv_> | where's the midpoint between 'easier' and 'harder'? |
| 05:42 | < Vornotron> | Looks like past 15 it gets only harder |
| 05:43 | < Vornotron> | 8 is anomalously difficult |
| 05:46 | | Reiv_ [NSwebIRC@Nightstar-q8avec.kinect.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 05:46 | < Vornotron> | http://imgur.com/rSziuqb ... he's gone |
| 05:47 | < Vornotron> | meh, somebody link it to him when he returns, I am sleepmadness |
| 05:48 | <@macdjord> | <Reiv_> So rolling a 1 is 16%, and rolling a 2 is 0? Neat. |
| 05:48 | <@macdjord> | Actually, rolling a 2 is /literally impossible/. This is not, in fact, the same thing as having a probability of 0~ |
| 05:50 | | * Vornotron beats up the pedant |
| 05:50 | | * macdjord substitutes himself with a pendant, allows Vorn to beat up that instead |
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| 08:24 | < Erik> | <a href="#who%20has%20access%20to%20t"> |
| 08:24 | | * Erik wonders just how the hell a link got mangled into this form. |
| 08:24 | < luke> | The big question is: what is 't'? |
| 08:24 | < Erik> | Cutoff. |
| 08:24 | < Erik> | It's one of several links, all of which are links to phrases initiated by #, separated with html space characters, and cut off without forming a full sentence |
| 08:25 | < Erik> | I'm guessing "the". |
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| 11:49 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[d00m] |
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| 14:10 | | * gnolam ponders rigging his database so that it plays "WELCOME TO YOUR DOOM" every time you perform an ALTER TABLE. |
| 14:11 | <@TheWatcher> | Doo eeet |
| 14:12 | | * TheWatcher swears vaguely at XML::Simple |
| 14:13 | <@TheWatcher> | I am telling you not to use a hash, why are you using a hash?! |
| 14:42 | <@gnolam> | Because it thinks that hash is for smoking? |
| 14:45 | <@TheWatcher> | Duuuude |
| 15:06 | <@Tarinaky> | Fuck regular expressions. |
| 15:07 | <@Tarinaky> | I have a stream consisting of lines of the form (value) (whitespace) (value) (whitespace) (value)... |
| 15:07 | <@Tarinaky> | I want to get the last two values on a line, and append it to a command in the form $CMD "value_n-1" value_n |
| 15:08 | <@Tarinaky> | Naturally, I thought regular expressions. |
| 15:09 | <@Tarinaky> | So I'm trying sed 's:\S*\s+\S*\s+(\S*)\s+(\S*):\1 \2:' |
| 15:09 | <@Tarinaky> | To at least strip out the values I care about. |
| 15:09 | <@Tarinaky> | But this isn't working. |
| 15:12 | <@TheWatcher> | Just the last two? |
| 15:21 | <@TheWatcher> | You might be able to do it easier using `awk '{print $(NF-1), $NF}'` |
| 15:22 | <&ToxicFrog> | Yeah, awk or (if the amount of whitespace between fields is known) cut are better options for this. |
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| 15:34 | <@RchrdB> | Tarinaky, GNU sed doesn't do capture groups like that unless you pass '-r', IIRC. |
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| 15:34 | <@RchrdB> | otherwise it defaults to a different, shittier (standard compliant, I think) grammar for regexes |
| 15:36 | <@Tarinaky> | Ahah |
| 15:36 | <@Tarinaky> | Thanks. |
| 15:39 | <&ToxicFrog> | Yeah, it's BRE by default, ERE if you pass -r |
| 15:40 | <&ToxicFrog> | But seriously, sed is the wrong tool for this. |
| 15:42 | < [R]> | cut or awk are better suited for that |
| 15:42 | < [R]> | (Assuming the amount of values is non variable) |
| 15:43 | <&ToxicFrog> | The awk approach TW suggested works for variable numbers of fields. |
| 15:43 | < [R]> | Yeah, didn't know it could do that |
| 15:43 | <&ToxicFrog> | cut will also work for variable numbers assuming the amount of whitespace between them is constant. |
| 15:43 | <&ToxicFrog> | sed will not, at least not as written there. |
| 15:46 | <@Tarinaky> | I already solved the problem in sed tbh |
| 16:04 | <@Tarinaky> | Looking at cut it wouldn't have worked for my purposes as it only handles a single delimiter character rather than 'variable chunks of whitespace' |
| 16:40 | <@RchrdB> | awk is really useful because it defaults to "\s+" as the delimiter |
| 16:40 | <@RchrdB> | echo "foo bar baz" | awk '{print $2}' # prints "bar" |
| 16:40 | <@RchrdB> | echo "foo bar baz" | awk '{print $2}' # prints "bar" too |
| 16:40 | <@RchrdB> | echo " foo bar beer" | awk '{print $2}' # prints "beer" instead ;P |
| 16:40 | <@RchrdB> | er |
| 16:40 | <@RchrdB> | echo " foo bar beer" | awk '{print $3}' # prints "beer" instead ;P |
| 16:41 | <@RchrdB> | can't count |
| 16:51 | <&ToxicFrog> | Tarinaky: yes, hence my caveat of "assuming the amount of whitespace between them is constant" |
| 17:17 | <@Tarinaky> | RchrdB: That wouldn't have helped me as I had fields like "7 CAPITALS Foo bar Baz quuz" |
| 17:20 | <@Tarinaky> | Where 'Foo bar' is a field. |
| 17:20 | <@RchrdB> | Yeah you're fucked there. |
| 17:20 | <@Tarinaky> | I wrote a regexp that did it. Should I write a whitepaper? |
| 17:21 | <@Tarinaky> | :P |
| 17:21 | <@Azash> | Wahey, I kind of have my BSc thesis topic agreed on |
| 17:21 | <@Azash> | Looks like it's gonna be I2P |
| 17:21 | <&McMartin> | EAP I2P? |
| 17:21 | <&McMartin> | Er, rather, what does I2P mean, not Extensible Authentication Protocol |
| 17:21 | <@Tarinaky> | It's an extension of I2C isn't it? |
| 17:22 | <&McMartin> | OK, fine, I'll look it up like a responsible adult :grump: |
| 17:22 | <&McMartin> | Invisible Internet Project? |
| 17:22 | <@Azash> | Yeah |
| 17:23 | <@Azash> | An attempt to improve on TOR from what I understand (disclaimer that I haven't really delved much into it before) |
| 17:23 | | * McMartin nods |
| 17:23 | <&McMartin> | A quick scan of the wiki reveals a Tor plugin |
| 17:24 | <&McMartin> | It appears to want to be to TCP/IP what Tor is to web access |
| 17:28 | <@Azash> | Going to be interesting juggling analysis I, a master's-level distsys course, the BSc thesis, and 25h of work per week |
| 17:28 | < [R]> | Tor does TCP/IP AFAIK, since it's explicitly mentioned that many Tor exit nodes block bittorrent |
| 17:29 | <&McMartin> | [R] Right; I2P seems to want to close that "hole" and put some level of anonymization all the way down |
| 17:29 | <&McMartin> | Really it's more that Tor is solving a different problem, but people don't look at it that way from the application layer |
| 17:29 | < [R]> | Which hole? |
| 17:30 | <&McMartin> | People think of Tor as an Internet that they can't track you on |
| 17:30 | <&McMartin> | As opposed to "that bit in Uplink where you make yourself harder to trace for awhile so that you have more time to properly cover your tracks" |
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| 19:01 | | * gnolam flails at icons. |
| 19:03 | <@gnolam> | I have a program where you can search for, browse for, and inspect Things. |
| 19:04 | <@gnolam> | I'm having trouble thinking up what would make intuitive and distinctive icons for those actions - "search", "browse" and "view details". |
| 19:07 | <&McMartin> | View details: magnifying glass |
| 19:21 | | Kindamoody|afk is now known as Kindamoody |
| 19:32 | <&ToxicFrog> | McMartin: traditionally, magnifying glass is "search" |
| 19:33 | <&McMartin> | ... hrm, I'm used to it also being "more information" |
| 19:33 | <&McMartin> | Maybe glass with an i under the lens |
| 19:39 | <&ToxicFrog> | Magnifying glass is, at least, the icon for search in every mail reader and browser (that has such an icon) I've used in the past decade. |
| 19:40 | <&ToxicFrog> | And every mobile app. |
| 19:40 | <&McMartin> | Yes |
| 19:41 | <&McMartin> | That is not, however, the *only* thing I've seen it used for |
| 19:41 | <&McMartin> | I suppose when search is an option there could be confusion |
| 19:41 | <&ToxicFrog> | It's also the standard GNOME icon for both "find" and "search", looks like. |
| 19:41 | <&McMartin> | Circle with a serif-font 'i' |
| 19:41 | <&ToxicFrog> | Yeah, but when you have "search" and "details" right next to each other... |
| 19:41 | <&McMartin> | I'm not disputing that it's used for search. |
| 19:49 | <@gnolam> | Hmm. Circled 'i' might work for the details. Thanks. |
| 19:50 | <@gnolam> | Now I just need to come up with something clever for "browse". |
| 19:54 | <&McMartin> | Possibly an open folder icon? |
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| 23:23 | <@macdjord|slep> | gnolam: A cow chewing grass~ |
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| --- Log closed Fri Aug 29 00:00:45 2014 |