| --- Log opened Wed Oct 13 00:00:18 2010 |
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| 00:13 | <@McMartin> | Augh |
| 00:13 | <@McMartin> | http://alienryderflex.com/brace_style/brace01.html |
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| 00:19 | | mode/#code [+o Syloqs-AFH] by Reiver |
| 00:20 | < celticminstrel> | Huh, apparently I showed up just in time for a netsplit. And that code looks ugly McM... |
| 00:21 | <@McMartin> | Yeah, it's the second most horrible brace discipline I've ever seen |
| 00:21 | < celticminstrel> | What's the most horrible? |
| 00:22 | <@McMartin> | The official GNU style |
| 00:22 | <@McMartin> | Which is BSD style with four spaces per indent level and a half-indent for each brace, each on its own line |
| 00:22 | <@McMartin> | It shares all the disadvantages of all other styles |
| 00:22 | < celticminstrel> | Oh? |
| 00:23 | <@McMartin> | No brace alignment with any code blocks; wasted vertical space; unusual dependency on the space/tab distinction |
| 00:23 | <@McMartin> | This version merely uses an entirely alien mehcanism for formatted alignment |
| 00:25 | < celticminstrel> | I put my opening braces on the same line as the statement they belong to, and else clauses go on the same line as the preceding closing brace (if there's a brace there at all). |
| 00:26 | <@McMartin> | And then closing braces on their own line, aligned with the line that had the opening brace's beginning? |
| 00:26 | <@McMartin> | That's "K&R style", arguably the one with the greatest body of tradition. |
| 00:28 | < celticminstrel> | Closing braces go on their own line unless they are followed by else or while. |
| 00:28 | < celticminstrel> | And yes, aligned with the opening line. |
| 00:28 | < celticminstrel> | Occasionally I'll put a full if...else on one line, but that's rare; they're rarely short enough to fit. |
| 00:31 | < celticminstrel> | When I'm using Xcode I sometimes have to fight its auto-indent conventions. |
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| 01:17 | <@Vornicus> | I personally use K&R-shaped stuff. |
| 01:19 | <@Vornicus> | and yeah, that code style scares the cheese out of me. |
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| 02:05 | | * Vornicus randomly tries writing the thing he's having Kaura do. Writes a dictionary called PEMDAS |
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| 03:02 | | * ToxicFrog once again ponders mixins and serialization |
| 03:07 | <@Vornicus> | anyway. Kaura! |
| 03:07 | < Kaura> | Vorn! |
| 03:08 | <@Vornicus> | Let us journey to the center of the interpreter! |
| 03:08 | <@Vornicus> | (for that is, indeed, what we are writing!) |
| 03:08 | < Kaura> | Eexcellent. |
| 03:09 | <@Vornicus> | I actually don't know precisely where we are; could you paste your code? |
| 03:09 | < Kaura> | If I recall correctly, I got stumped early on last time. Let's see... |
| 03:10 | < Kaura> | http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/425 |
| 03:11 | <@Vornicus> | Ah, so. |
| 03:12 | < Kaura> | Though most of the setback was because I had to prepare for the job interview the day after - and I ended up winging it anyhow. >_>;;; |
| 03:12 | < Kaura> | Lemme find the notes I took too. |
| 03:12 | <@Vornicus> | Okay, so. NUM and OP actually should get defined before the class, just as you have defined the other constants. Then we can use NUM and OP instead of 0 and 1 when talking about the mode we're in. |
| 03:12 | < Kaura> | Ahh. |
| 03:13 | < Kaura> | Oh, wait, they were defined outside of the class. Why'd I put a second iteration there? |
| 03:13 | <@Vornicus> | Dunno, but you should use ALLCAPS because they're constants. |
| 03:14 | < Kaura> | Right, fixed. |
| 03:16 | <@Vornicus> | All right. Now before we get too far we need a PEMDAS dictionary - each operator symbol (after translation, so u- etc are in there) must give a list of symbols that if it was preceded by, it forces to get removed. |
| 03:18 | <@Vornicus> | er, not removed per se, but "executed now" |
| 03:20 | <@Vornicus> | ...which is to say: when you encounter an operator, you will check the operators you've already received and execute those that must happen before this one can work. This dictionary, then, will tell you, for each operator, what operators it must do this with. |
| 03:24 | <@Vornicus> | So for +, for instance, it will include all 10 operators; same with -, because addition and subtraction happen left-to-right and thus all preceding +s and -s have to happen before it, and because they're technically last. |
| 03:24 | < Kaura> | Alright, lesse. So in order of hierarchy then, right? |
| 03:25 | <@Vornicus> | * and / and % don't have + or -, but they do have * and / and %; d is a bit tricky, I'd actually put it so it doesn't have * or / or % but does have the last four. ^ and the unaries are /empty/ |
| 03:27 | <@Vornicus> | so this is a string: list of strings dictionary. |
| 03:32 | < Kaura> | Lesse if I'm on the right track... http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/426 |
| 03:32 | <@Vornicus> | hokay lessee. |
| 03:33 | <@Vornicus> | 1. they should be strings, not just things. 2. %'s list is the same as / or *'s because it's technically division. |
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| 03:33 | <@Vornicus> | ^'s should be completely empty. |
| 03:34 | <@Vornicus> | you're missing ud. d should include ^ and itself. |
| 03:36 | <@Vornicus> | (there's a bit of ridiculousness with d in that I've never seen anything actually chain d.) |
| 03:39 | < Kaura> | So more like this. http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/427 |
| 03:41 | <@Vornicus> | closer. % still needs *, I'd rearrange it so it goes add/sub, mult/divs, roll, exp, unary, and your empty things should actually be tuple(). And you need a closing bracket. |
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| 03:45 | <@Vornicus> | oh, and ud needs to be empty, for the same reason that - is. |
| 03:48 | < Kaura> | Wait, I'm not quite sure what you meant by that. You said I forgot ud last time - I thought you meant it should be like "d" |
| 03:48 | <@Vornicus> | You didn't include it in the dctionary |
| 03:49 | <@Vornicus> | and I mean, ud needs to be empty for the same reason u- is: you can't execute it yet because it doesn't have its only input. |
| 03:49 | <@Vornicus> | Erp. YOu can't execute the /previous/ yet, no matter what it is, because it doesn't have its last input. |
| 04:03 | <@Vornicus> | So... anyway. |
| 04:03 | < Kaura> | Alright, think I got it right this time. http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/428 |
| 04:03 | < Kaura> | (sorry, so many distractions. ;_;) |
| 04:04 | <@Vornicus> | Yes, except that instead of saying (), say tuple() |
| 04:04 | < Kaura> | Oh, whups. |
| 04:04 | < celticminstrel> | Isn't it the same? |
| 04:06 | <@Vornicus> | ...huh, it is. I didn't know that. |
| 04:14 | <@Vornicus> | Anyway we've got that. Now we need to write our evaluate function. Most of this stuff is pretty straightforward. The only thing I haven't really fully explained is how you actually execute the operators; just... gloss over that, get the other bits going. |
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| 04:21 | <@Vornicus> | ...huh. YOu don't actually need a PEMDAS entry for the unary ops. Shoulda figured that out. Ah well. |
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| 04:35 | | * Vornicus fiddles. His own postfixizer -- which actually converts from infix to postfix notation -- (3 + 4) * 5 becomes 3 4 + 5 * -- is 34 lines in 3 function. |
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| 04:52 | <@Vornicus> | and then the postfix evaluator is another 11 lines, and I'm done. THis is officially 80 lines shorter than the last time I did it. |
| 04:55 | <@Vornicus> | (among other things: using operator instead of building my own wrappers killed about 30 lines in itself.) |
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| 05:32 | | * Vornicus fiddles. Ah one thing that needs to be fixed if we want to stay in integers: you have to block negative exponents. |
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| 05:46 | | mode/#code [+o McMartin] by Reiver |
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| 15:53 | | mode/#code [+o ToxicFrog] by Reiver |
| 16:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...hrm |
| 16:20 | <@ToxicFrog> | My local felt repo is not linked to the github one |
| 16:20 | <@ToxicFrog> | I wonder what happened? |
| 16:35 | <@Vornicus-Latens> | Explosions and fire. |
| 16:38 | <@ToxicFrog> | Possibly. |
| 16:38 | | * ToxicFrog ponders his serialization format some more |
| 16:41 | | * TheWatcher eyes this email |
| 16:42 | <@TheWatcher> | "Is someone going to be able to reverse engineer a way around the security in $SYSTEM because it is open source?" |
| 16:44 | <@TheWatcher> | I'd slap them upside the head, but I really can't be arsed today |
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| 19:10 | < Tarinaky> | Evening gentlemen/ladies. |
| 19:18 | | Reiv [orthianz@Nightstar-1b04b1b9.xnet.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 19:42 | <@jerith> | And so it is. |
| 19:51 | < Tarinaky> | Contemplating trying to put together a simple TBS in python. |
| 19:51 | <@jerith> | TBS? |
| 19:51 | < Tarinaky> | Turn-based strategy. |
| 19:51 | <@ToxicFrog> | Turn Based Stratedammit |
| 19:51 | < Tarinaky> | <TheWatcher> Go forth and educate thyself! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_Isle_(series) |
| 19:51 | <@jerith> | Tarinaky: foxassault.org |
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| 19:53 | <@jerith> | Dammit, gnome-terminal! Stealing my keypresses is /rude/. |
| 19:53 | <@jerith> | This channel is number 13 in my irssi, which means it lives on M-e. |
| 19:54 | <@jerith> | gnome-terminal wants M-e to mean "display this menu that jerith never ever uses". ;_; |
| 19:54 | < Tarinaky> | Heh. |
| 19:54 | < Tarinaky> | I never liked gnome-terminal. |
| 19:55 | <@jerith> | So now this window lives in M-w C-n or M-r C-p. |
| 19:55 | < Tarinaky> | It felt a bit too weighty for a terminal emulator. |
| 19:55 | <@jerith> | I don't like it either. |
| 19:55 | <@jerith> | But this netbook has Gnome on it. |
| 19:55 | < Tarinaky> | So? |
| 19:55 | < Tarinaky> | That doesn't preclude you changing over to urxvt or aterm or whatever. |
| 19:55 | < Tarinaky> | >.> |
| 19:56 | <@jerith> | And I'm logged in as my girlfriend, because she was logged in when I started backing it up in preparation for repaving it. |
| 19:56 | <@jerith> | I'm pretty sure I have xterm on it. |
| 19:56 | <@jerith> | I seldom actually use a console, though. |
| 19:56 | < Tarinaky> | Then again. I went through the trouble of installing gnome without nautilus just because I like the look of gnome-panel >.> |
| 19:56 | < Tarinaky> | I think this officially makes me crazy. |
| 19:57 | <@jerith> | I have Gnome because the netbook UI thing is reasonable. |
| 19:57 | <@jerith> | And it has all the widgets for everything. |
| 19:58 | <@jerith> | But I'm starting to wonder if maybe I shouldn't just chuck Lenny on it and do the wifi stuff the hard way. |
| 19:58 | <@jerith> | Network Manager has been fighting with me for ages. |
| 20:00 | < Tarinaky> | jerith: I don't see how your link helps me :/ |
| 20:01 | <@jerith> | Tarinaky: It's a TBS (sort of) that I helped write in Python. |
| 20:17 | < Namegduf> | jerith: What's NetworkManager being doing that's annoying? |
| 20:17 | < Namegduf> | I'm curious, because normally I prefer to do things manually, but I've actually been happy enough to use NetworkManager. |
| 20:21 | <@jerith> | Namegduf: It keeps wanting desperately to be connected to the wifi network that it used once when it was in a cifferent city. |
| 20:22 | <@jerith> | It occasionally refuses to admit that the ethernet port exists until I manually remove and recreate the wired network. |
| 20:22 | < Namegduf> | Weird. |
| 20:22 | < Namegduf> | The former I know about. |
| 20:22 | < Namegduf> | It's stupid. |
| 20:23 | < Namegduf> | Once you've connected once to a network, it adds it as an "Auto blah" network. |
| 20:23 | < Namegduf> | If you don't want it to reconnect on seeing that SSID again, you have to delete it. |
| 20:27 | <@jerith> | That's not it. |
| 20:28 | <@jerith> | It thinks it's connected to that SSID, but the network in question is a thousand miles away. (Literally, in this case.) |
| 20:30 | < Namegduf> | Wow, weird. |
| 20:30 | < Tarinaky> | I think if I ever got a netbook I'd end up writing my own front-end wrapper because they're all a bit naff :/ |
| 20:30 | < Tarinaky> | *for wireless networks. |
| 20:30 | < Namegduf> | I don't use one. |
| 20:30 | < Namegduf> | Oh, that. |
| 20:30 | < Namegduf> | I've not had any trouble with NetworkManager, but I run whatever's in Debian Unstable. |
| 20:31 | < Namegduf> | Maybe they unbroke it some. |
| 20:31 | < Tarinaky> | I don't want to have to bring up the interface manually every time I boot up... |
| 20:31 | < Namegduf> | jerith: That feature of gnome-terminal can be turned off in options, I think. |
| 20:31 | < Tarinaky> | But at the same time I don't want it to hang during bootup because it can't connect to a network it's not physically connected to >.< |
| 20:31 | < Namegduf> | Not 100% (I use Terminal from XFCE, not gnome-terminal) but it is what I remember. |
| 20:32 | < Tarinaky> | Anywya. BRB in a bit. |
| 20:33 | < Namegduf> | I would recommend against installing Lenny because we're approaching the release of the next stable. |
| 20:33 | < Namegduf> | Squeeze is frozen, you'd be better to just install that. |
| 20:34 | < PinkFreud> | oh, did debian *finally* freeze squeeze? |
| 20:34 | < Namegduf> | Yes, on the 6th of August. |
| 20:36 | < PinkFreud> | ahh, fun. |
| 20:37 | < PinkFreud> | we'll be having a fun time with our ESX infrastructure, then |
| 20:38 | < Namegduf> | Looks like they're integrating two "architectures" using the FreeBSD kernel into the main build process. |
| 20:38 | < PinkFreud> | we're on an outdated patch which presents a broken dmi table to the OS. |
| 20:38 | < PinkFreud> | Namegduf: yeah, k/freebsd. I've already reported a bug in the installer for that one. |
| 20:39 | < Namegduf> | Ah. |
| 20:39 | < PinkFreud> | the dmi table bug is a fun one. apparently, the linux kernel received an overhaul to it's dmi handling code in 2.6.27, which causes linux kernels past .26 to puke horribly at boot on the buggy vmware patch. |
| 20:40 | < Namegduf> | Ah. |
| 20:40 | < Namegduf> | What does it take to fix that? |
| 20:40 | < PinkFreud> | I've only been warning my boss that we're going to have a huge issue the moment we try to install a squeeze VM. |
| 20:40 | < PinkFreud> | going to a newer patchlevel for ESX 3.5, or switching to 4.0 |
| 20:41 | < PinkFreud> | the former is easier. |
| 20:41 | < Namegduf> | Is this an internal/single-company setup? |
| 20:41 | < PinkFreud> | the boss started off by insisting that he was going to switch us to 4.0. this never happened, which I successfully predicted. |
| 20:41 | < PinkFreud> | internal, yes. |
| 20:41 | < Namegduf> | Ah. |
| 20:42 | < Namegduf> | Hope it's a smooth migration, then. I don't know how long it'll be before Squeeze becomes the new Stable, though. |
| 20:43 | < PinkFreud> | dunno either. I'm done warning him at this point. If this becomes an emergency patch situation, when we had 6+ months to schedule patches, I'm making damn sure this issue goes up the ladder. |
| 20:48 | | * PinkFreud shrugs |
| 20:48 | < PinkFreud> | sorry, just venting. this place has become unbearable. |
| 20:48 | < Namegduf> | That sucks. |
| 20:49 | < PinkFreud> | we run from one emergency to another, many of which are caused by the boss' refusal to do anything until absolutely necessary. |
| 21:06 | < Anno[Laptop]> | It says something about the Linux's options when I choose to run MS Paint through WINE to get something simple drawn, like boxes with text in them. |
| 21:07 | | * Anno[Laptop] stabs at GIMP with the off-hand weapon. |
| 21:07 | < Namegduf> | Honestly, GIMP is bad, really bad, but MS Paint is just awful. |
| 21:08 | < gnolam> | If you're /just/ doing boxes with text in them, you shouldn't be doing it in a raster program anyway. |
| 21:08 | < gnolam> | Even if GIMP's UI is the evil spawn of a generation of vipers. |
| 21:09 | < Namegduf> | I once opened a menu and got attacked by a snake. |
| 21:10 | < Anno[Laptop]> | I disagree than Paint is awful. Paint is good. Its GUI is simple, and if its functionality is limited, that's because it's not meant to be used for 'professional' work. |
| 21:11 | < Anno[Laptop]> | It has two types of cropping, eraser, flood-fill, brush, freehand, line, curve, a few polygons - and that's all that's needed. |
| 21:12 | < Namegduf> | I do not, personally, find working in Paint easy, even for simple tasks. |
| 21:12 | < Anno[Laptop]> | I do. |
| 21:12 | < celticminstrel> | If I recall, it has some rather annoying things. |
| 21:12 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Such as? |
| 21:13 | <@TheWatcher> | Anno[Laptop]: if you want boxes and text, use Dia |
| 21:13 | < celticminstrel> | I don't quite remember. It's not like I ever use it. <_< |
| 21:13 | < Namegduf> | My experience and memory is basically the same as celticminstrel. |
| 21:13 | < celticminstrel> | Probably related to little details of behaviour. |
| 21:13 | <@TheWatcher> | Dia's basically just there for making boxes, lines, text, and stuff for diagrams |
| 21:14 | < Namegduf> | I remember going "Argh" repeatedly at trying to get things more than in the vaguely right location, even shapes, etc. Possibly related to adjusting shapes after initially creating them, which Paint can't do... |
| 21:14 | < Anno[Laptop]> | I can see how that approach leads to pain. |
| 21:14 | < celticminstrel> | Because it's raster, yes... |
| 21:15 | < Anno[Laptop]> | When I draw something badly, I Ctrl+Z and redraw. |
| 21:15 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Until I get it right. |
| 21:15 | < Namegduf> | Because it immediately rasterises, yes. |
| 21:15 | < Anno[Laptop]> | I may be somewhat biased because Paint is the definition of a graphics editor. |
| 21:15 | < Anno[Laptop]> | *for me |
| 21:16 | < Namegduf> | Forgive me for being sceptical, but I don't think MS invented graphics editors. |
| 21:16 | < Anno[Laptop]> | It's the first one I used, and it shapes my expectations. |
| 21:17 | < Namegduf> | Well... was the first one I used, as well. |
| 21:17 | <@ToxicFrog> | The first one I used was a very primitive AT&T UNIX image editor back in 1990. |
| 21:17 | <@ToxicFrog> | It was better than Paint. |
| 21:17 | | * TheWatcher used DPaint 1 back in '86... |
| 21:18 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Personally, I would prefer to use Flash 5, but installing that on Linux is a PAIN. |
| 21:18 | < gnolam> | Deluxe Paint III <3 |
| 21:18 | < celticminstrel> | The first one I used was likely ClarisWorks. |
| 21:18 | <@TheWatcher> | gnolam: still have that, and TVPaint, installed in my UAE install :D |
| 21:18 | < celticminstrel> | Though it's slightly possible that I may have used Paint before that. |
| 21:18 | < gnolam> | I have no idea which my first graphics editor was. But DP3 is still, after all these years, awesome. |
| 21:18 | < celticminstrel> | I actually still have AppleWorks on this computer, though I don't really use it anymore. |
| 21:18 | < Anno[Laptop]> | I can't even get Virtual Box to work on this installation, for some reason. When I launch a machine, it complains that I don't have a module installed, which happens to be installed. |
| 21:19 | | aoanla [AndChat@Nightstar-54f0d4f7.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #code |
| 21:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | Anno[Laptop]: bet you anything that you upgraded the kernel and didn't notice. The error message gives you a command you can copy-paste into the terminal to fix it. |
| 21:23 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Yes. |
| 21:23 | < Anno[Laptop]> | When I paste it, it FATAL ERROR: module not present or something. |
| 21:24 | < Anno[Laptop]> | "FATAL: Module vboxdrv not found." |
| 21:24 | < Anno[Laptop]> | I did apply some kind of patch or whatever it's called, when I was installing the proprietary drivers for the WiFi adapter. Could this be the problem? |
| 21:24 | < aoanla> | locate vboxdrv.ko |
| 21:25 | < Anno[Laptop]> | /lib/modules/2.6.26-2-486/extra/virtualbox-ose/vboxdrv.ko |
| 21:25 | <@ToxicFrog> | Are there any earlier errors? That command is meant to recompile the module if needed, then insmod it |
| 21:25 | <@ToxicFrog> | It sounds like the insmod is failing, which implies that the compile is also failing |
| 21:26 | < aoanla> | uname -a |
| 21:26 | < Anno[Laptop]> | No earlier errors. |
| 21:26 | < aoanla> | Also, modprobe vboxdrv ? |
| 21:26 | < Anno[Laptop]> | 2.6.26-2-686 #1 SMP Thu Sep 16 19:35:51 UTC 2010 i686 GNU/Linux |
| 21:26 | < Anno[Laptop]> | aoanla: FATAL: Module vboxdrv not found. |
| 21:28 | < Namegduf> | Are we sure that you did the rebuild? |
| 21:29 | < Anno[Laptop]> | How do I check? The WiFi works fine. |
| 21:29 | < Namegduf> | Hmm. |
| 21:29 | < Namegduf> | Is this installed from a Debian package? |
| 21:30 | < Namegduf> | If so, cheap, lazy, easy fix is just to reinstall it. |
| 21:30 | < Namegduf> | I suspect "/etc/init.d/vboxdrv setup" is what you needed to run, though. |
| 21:31 | < aoanla> | ln -s /lib/modules/2.6.28-2-486/extra/virtualbox-ose /lib/modules/2.6.26-2-686/extra/virtualbox-ose |
| 21:31 | < aoanla> | depmod -a |
| 21:32 | < aoanla> | then, if those work, try modprobing it again |
| 21:32 | < Anno[Laptop]> | ln: creating symbolic link `/lib/modules/2.6.26-2-686/extra/virtualbox-ose': No such file or directory |
| 21:32 | < aoanla> | Aha. |
| 21:32 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Namegduf: What's installed from a Debian package? |
| 21:33 | < Namegduf> | VirtualBox. |
| 21:33 | < aoanla> | Does /lib/modules/2.6.26-1-686 exist? |
| 21:33 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Yeah. |
| 21:33 | < Namegduf> | Yeah. |
| 21:33 | < Namegduf> | Just reinstall it. |
| 21:33 | < Namegduf> | I noticed you have the OSE version, and the only reason I can think for having that is installing from the Debian repo. |
| 21:33 | < Anno[Laptop]> | aoanla: No. |
| 21:34 | | celticminstrel [celticminstre@Nightstar-f8b608eb.cable.rogers.com] has left #code [] |
| 21:34 | < Anno[Laptop]> | It does seem to be different from the version that I was using before, on the computer than exploded. |
| 21:34 | < aoanla> | No, you can get the owe from the website. |
| 21:34 | < aoanla> | ...Ose. |
| 21:34 | < Namegduf> | You *can*, but I don't know why someone would explicitly pick it. |
| 21:34 | < Namegduf> | While the OSE is rather the default from the repo. |
| 21:35 | < Namegduf> | (I don't know if non-free has the full version or not) |
| 21:35 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Okay, so. I remove this crap, and try to install a normal version? |
| 21:35 | < aoanla> | Because you are scared by Oracle? |
| 21:35 | < Namegduf> | You could, but you could also just reinstall the version you have. |
| 21:35 | < Namegduf> | It's a very brute-force way to force a kernel module rebuild. |
| 21:35 | < aoanla> | Yeah, I'd try a reinstall first. |
| 21:36 | < Namegduf> | But, before you do that, I think ToxicFrog was trying to get you to run "/etc/init.d/vboxdrv setup" |
| 21:36 | < Namegduf> | And you actually ran something involving modprobe. |
| 21:36 | < Namegduf> | If I'm right about what you ran, try the vboxdrv command. |
| 21:36 | < Namegduf> | That's the normal way of asking an installed VirtualBox to rebuild its kernel module. |
| 21:36 | < Namegduf> | You will probably need to do it as root. |
| 21:37 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Too late. Already removed. I didn't have anything on it, really. |
| 21:38 | | * Anno[Laptop] downloads the proper real one-true VB from the website. |
| 21:38 | | * Tarinaky pokes ToxicFrog. |
| 21:45 | < Anno[Laptop]> | Yay. I have installed it and it works. |
| 21:46 | < Namegduf> | Oh, it shouldn't have deleted your VMs. |
| 21:46 | < Namegduf> | I mean, technically upgrades are a reinstallation process. |
| 21:46 | < Namegduf> | But, hey, it worked. |
| 21:55 | | aoanla [AndChat@Nightstar-54f0d4f7.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [[NS] Quit: ] |
| 21:55 | <@ToxicFrog> | Tarinaky: yar? |
| 21:57 | < Tarinaky> | ToxicFrog: You mentioned making a battle isle clone or something. |
| 21:57 | < Tarinaky> | ToxicFrog: I don't really know how to do a simple tbs :/ |
| 21:57 | < Tarinaky> | Ignoring the computer bits, I'm not really sure what the rules would be >.< |
| 21:58 | <@ToxicFrog> | Er? |
| 21:58 | <@ToxicFrog> | I didn't, someone else did. |
| 21:58 | <@ToxicFrog> | I've never played BI. |
| 21:58 | < Tarinaky> | Oh. |
| 21:59 | < Tarinaky> | Derp. |
| 21:59 | < Tarinaky> | It was TheWatcher. |
| 21:59 | < Tarinaky> | Sorry TF. |
| 21:59 | < Tarinaky> | >.< |
| 22:01 | <@TheWatcher> | Tar: rules for a TBS system tend to be (depending on how you set it up) things like now many hexes a given unit can move per turn (which may or may not include constraints on turning, too), what sort of terrain they can cross and whether it has any move costs, and that sort of thing. You'll also need rules about firing - how far shots go, whether they can be aimed or area, what the area effect size is, how many shots per turn... |
| 22:02 | | Derakon [Derakon@Nightstar-1ffd02e6.ucsf.edu] has joined #code |
| 22:02 | | mode/#code [+o Derakon] by Reiver |
| 22:02 | <@TheWatcher> | 'lo Dera |
| 22:03 | <@Derakon> | G'day. |
| 22:06 | <@Derakon> | Sooo, one of the things my boss wanted me to do while he was travelling is try denoising some datasets he'd gotten from a cardiologist and an X-Ray computed tomography guy. |
| 22:07 | <@Derakon> | On the theory that we have a denoising algorithm that works nicely, we should try applying it to other areas. |
| 22:07 | <@Derakon> | He was really gung-ho about this, too. |
| 22:07 | <@TheWatcher> | 'cept it won't work? |
| 22:07 | <@Derakon> | I should note though that I'm the third person he's asked to work on it... |
| 22:07 | <@Derakon> | Well, the cardiograms are ultrasounds, i.e. they were collected with sonar. |
| 22:07 | <@Derakon> | And it turns out they have completely different noise characteristics from what our algorithm is intended to deal with. |
| 22:08 | | * TheWatcher nod |
| 22:08 | <@Derakon> | So basically our algo looks at the noise, says "Hm, this is data! I should preserve it!" and ends up doing jack diddly. |
| 22:08 | <@Derakon> | As for the X-ray CTs... |
| 22:08 | <@Derakon> | These are optical datasets, so it'd make sense that they'd have similar noise characteristics. |
| 22:08 | <@TheWatcher> | Eeh |
| 22:09 | <@Derakon> | But the images we have were collected with a sufficiently high exposure time that they aren't noisy. |
| 22:09 | <@Derakon> | After spending a week or so on the ultrasounds before our resident algorithm expert said "Yeah no, this won't work.", I asked him first for the X-ray CTs, and got the same response for a different reason. |
| 22:09 | <@Derakon> | So much for denoising! |
| 22:10 | <@TheWatcher> | From what I've run into, noise reduction algorithms need to be tailored specifically to the domain - trying one from one in another generally produces a complete mess... |
| 22:10 | <@Derakon> | Could you tell my boss that please? |
| 22:11 | <@TheWatcher> | I could probably ask one of the guys in the computer vision research group to tell him ;) |
| 22:12 | <@Derakon> | Heh. |
| 22:14 | <@Derakon> | Hmm...I wouldn't mind trying to work in robotics / computer vision / etc. for a bit. |
| 22:14 | <@Derakon> | Well, aside from the likely need for programming in C instead of Python~ |
| 22:22 | | * TheWatcher eyes this coder over at TTLG |
| 22:24 | <@TheWatcher> | People who violate the GPL because they're just lazy sods irritate me... |
| 22:24 | <@Derakon> | More Thief stuff? |
| 22:25 | < Anno[Laptop]> | I briefly wondered what Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann have to do with this channel. |
| 22:26 | < Tarinaky> | TheWatcher: Sounds a bit more complicated than I'd like :/ |
| 22:27 | | Orthia [orthianz@Nightstar-39e1b845.xnet.co.nz] has joined #code |
| 22:30 | <@TheWatcher> | Derakon: yeah; all of the libraries of new scripts for the dark engine are covered by the GPL (for complicated reasons). One of these libraries is failing randomly on Win7, and the source that should be available for people to look at and try to work out why, isn't |
| 22:30 | <@TheWatcher> | Tarinaky: so, implement as many or as few rules as you like |
| 22:30 | <@Derakon> | Whups. |
| 22:30 | <@TheWatcher> | s'your game. |
| 22:33 | <@TheWatcher> | (it's even more irritating, because said library contains some functions whose implementation I'd very much like to look at, so I can work out how to get something of my own to work (replaing normal tweq behaviour with sinusoidal tweqs, to make things like smooth swinging objects and the like)) |
| 22:33 | <@TheWatcher> | *replacing |
| 22:33 | <@Derakon> | TWEQ? |
| 22:35 | <@McMartin> | TW: Is this TTLG falling down, or Random Guy On The Internet? |
| 22:35 | <@TheWatcher> | Not an abbreviation - it's the name Dark uses for in-game movement or rotation of jointed objects, among other things) |
| 22:35 | <@Derakon> | Ah, some kind of animation file. |
| 22:35 | <@TheWatcher> | The latter - NamelessVoice, in fact, who should know better but apparently doesn't |
| 22:42 | | * Derakon mutters at this "use" of whitespace: http://paste.ubuntu.com/512684/ |
| 22:44 | <@TheWatcher> | ... |
| 22:44 | <@Derakon> | The previous author of this code had a fetish for lining up various elements (even to the extent of inserting spaces into strings so that the quotation marks would line up), but he couldn't even do it properly. |
| 22:46 | <@Derakon> | Oooh, here's a fun line: |
| 22:46 | <@Derakon> | , { # 1: conv==1 --> conv |
| 22:47 | <@Derakon> | Yes, he put the comma closing a previous {} section on the following line. |
| 22:47 | <@TheWatcher> | Ah, Mr Haas, is there any limit to your insanity? |
| 22:47 | <@Derakon> | Well, I haven't heard any news of Germany being overrun by seething nuclear chaos yet. |
| 22:50 | <@Derakon> | "the numbers below are actually for EM channel !! |
| 22:50 | <@Derakon> | for conv. channel the data ist first flipped in X !!!!" |
| 22:51 | <@TheWatcher> | Four exclamation marks? |
| 22:51 | <@TheWatcher> | Sure sign of an unhinged mind, that... |
| 22:52 | <@Derakon> | He burned a firewall between them and the rest of the text to make certain they wouldn't infect it~ |
| 22:53 | < Tarinaky> | Some mothers do have 'em. |
| 23:21 | <@ToxicFrog> | TheWatcher: bap Nameless with a psi-amp? |
| 23:46 | | shade_of_cpux [chatzilla@Nightstar-c978de34.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #code |
| 23:46 | | shade_of_cpux is now known as cpux |
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| --- Log closed Thu Oct 14 00:00:19 2010 |