| --- Log opened Thu May 06 00:00:53 2010 |
| 00:07 | | Syloqs_AFH [Syloq@NetworkAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has quit [Client closed the connection] |
| 00:23 | < Alek> | aw crap. |
| 00:24 | < Alek> | I have some sort of virus that once in a while opens a page at justin.tv. something about halo. |
| 00:25 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 00:27 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
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| 00:48 | < RichardBarrell> | Alek: reinstall Windows from scratch. |
| 00:49 | <@McMartin> | More seriously, run the usual Spybot/AdAware suite and see what it finds. |
| 00:49 | <@Namegduf> | Actually, that was good advice if you can do it practically |
| 00:50 | <@Namegduf> | Once a system is compromised, only safe thing being totally reimaging, etc. |
| 00:51 | <@McMartin> | There's a base assumption that you have nothing of value on any of your machines |
| 00:51 | <@Namegduf> | You're presumed to copy off anything of value first |
| 00:52 | <@McMartin> | Which can easily include whatever infected you in the first place |
| 00:52 | <@McMartin> | Depends on the attack vector |
| 00:52 | <@Namegduf> | Which is why you scan it from a clean machine if said stuff includes unbacked up potential attack vector files. |
| 01:02 | <@Namegduf> | It's imperfect, but better than not cleaning out the OS at all. |
| 01:04 | <@McMartin> | True |
| 01:04 | <@McMartin> | If this is a browser hijack, though, a basic registry reset is probably enough. |
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| 01:05 | <@Namegduf> | Yeah, if it looks easy to cleanup and you know what you're doing, can be okay to risk just doing that and save the time. |
| 01:05 | <@McMartin> | And if it's "you have a page somewhere who's got a banner ad that's firing up popunders", reinstalling your whole OS is seriously overkill. >_> |
| 01:05 | <@Namegduf> | Haha. |
| 01:06 | <@Namegduf> | Yes, I did take "I have a virus" as meaning they'd figured it out, yeah. |
| 01:06 | <@McMartin> | The "something about Halo" makes me suspicious, though~ |
| 01:07 | < Alek> | I have 5 hard drives of stuff here. -_- |
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| 01:08 | < Alek> | well, it's happened twice so far. |
| 01:09 | < Alek> | both times I've come home after being gone all day and seen the browser open, pointing to justin.tv, some halo-related broadcast. not running, at least. |
| 01:09 | < Alek> | I know it wasn't anyone else here, so that leaves a hijack in the machine. |
| 01:09 | <@McMartin> | That sounds a lot more like a popup ad than like a virus. |
| 01:09 | <@McMartin> | So yes, I would absolutely start with a reputable set of malware/adware scans. |
| 01:10 | <@McMartin> | Spybot Search and Destroy and LavaSoft(I think?) AdAware are both free and pretty good. |
| 01:11 | < Alek> | spybot it is, then. I should have installed it by now, actually. >_> |
| 01:12 | | * Alek remembers something, laughs. |
| 01:12 | < Alek> | anyone know Avira Antivirus? |
| 01:12 | <@McMartin> | Not ringing any bells |
| 01:13 | < Alek> | they call their scanning module Luke Filewalker. :P |
| 01:13 | <@Namegduf> | Heard of it, no real knowledge of it. |
| 01:13 | <@McMartin> | Siiiigh |
| 01:13 | <@McMartin> | Hm |
| 01:13 | <@McMartin> | Anyone here used the "Mantis" bugtracking system? |
| 01:13 | <@Namegduf> | Rings a bell. |
| 01:13 | <@McMartin> | (Sorry, total subject change) |
| 01:13 | <@Namegduf> | Not more than that. |
| 01:13 | <@McMartin> | Yeah, likewise. |
| 01:14 | <@McMartin> | Someone's comparison shopping and I have no idea how it stacks up with, e.g. Trac |
| 01:14 | <@Namegduf> | I've used it, but couldn't help with the comparison much. |
| 01:15 | <@McMartin> | Ah well |
| 01:15 | | * McMartin has only used Trac and Bugzilla, neither of which have a great deal to recommend them |
| 01:15 | <@McMartin> | Trac's marginally better, but it's trying to be Some Of Everything and if you aren't explicitly going for a single interface to everything it's probably not what you want |
| 01:16 | <@McMartin> | While I can't point at any single "this is fundamentally wrong" thing about Bugzilla, all my experiences with it have been *terrible* |
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| 01:24 | < Alek> | aaaugh. |
| 01:24 | | * Alek swears at Bioshock muchly. |
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| 02:04 | < Alek> | eeeyep. |
| 02:04 | < Alek> | a whole 85 browser hijacks. |
| 02:04 | < Alek> | most of them StatCounter. |
| 02:05 | <@Namegduf> | StatCounter doesn't look like malware. |
| 02:05 | <@Namegduf> | Are you sure you're not mixing up "tracking cookies" with browser hijacks? |
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| 03:37 | < Alek> | Nameg, that's what Spybot told me. >_> |
| 03:42 | <@ToxicFrog> | Spybot includes tracking cookies in its scan. |
| 03:42 | <@ToxicFrog> | So it will turn up huge numbers of results on rpetty much any system. |
| 03:51 | < Zed_> | Yeah. |
| 03:51 | < Zed_> | Browser hijacks are quite visible, btw |
| 03:51 | < Zed_> | They're where you open it and try to do your normal tasks, and then suddenly ridiculous shit happens. |
| 03:51 | < Zed_> | Or when you're at your computer and NOT opening your browser, and it opens by itself and starts doing things. |
| 03:52 | <@McMartin> | The latter is believed to be happening |
| 03:52 | < Zed_> | IE sorta malware thingy? |
| 03:53 | < Zed_> | Yeah, those suck. |
| 03:53 | < Zed_> | malwarebytes is a good tool for checking on stuff like that, btw |
| 03:53 | < Zed_> | My tool of choice |
| 03:53 | < Zed_> | if no-one's suggested it yet, consider it suggested |
| 03:57 | <@McMartin> | That one hasn't come up yet, so. |
| 03:59 | < Alek> | it actually opened in Firefox, not IE. :P |
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| 07:28 | < Tarinaky> | Hunh. I didn't know there was an operator class*. |
| 07:29 | < Tarinaky> | A conversion operator ^^. Handy. |
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| 14:27 | <@ToxicFrog> | "class*"? |
| 15:57 | < celticminstrel> | I hate it when installers don't give you a "restart later" option. At least launching an application cancels restart though. |
| 15:58 | <@jerith> | Restart the application or the system? |
| 15:58 | < celticminstrel> | System. |
| 15:58 | <@jerith> | The *only* thing that should require a system restart is a system update. |
| 15:59 | < celticminstrel> | Or installing drivers, I assume? |
| 15:59 | <@jerith> | Drivers are "system", really. |
| 16:00 | < celticminstrel> | Exactly. |
| 16:00 | < celticminstrel> | For some reason Safari updates also require restart. |
| 16:00 | <@jerith> | Nothing should *ever* restart the system without explicit permission. |
| 16:00 | < celticminstrel> | Agreed. |
| 16:00 | <@jerith> | Safari's built into the OS the same way IE is. |
| 16:01 | <@jerith> | Crappy, but. |
| 16:01 | < celticminstrel> | It used to be very common on Mac to restart unconditionally, though, and apparently some installers still try to do it. |
| 16:01 | <@jerith> | The people who write that crap need to die in a very painful fire. |
| 16:01 | < celticminstrel> | Now, however, I can cancel their attempt to restart. |
| 16:02 | | * jerith is used to an OS that only requires a reboot for kernel updates. |
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| 16:52 | <@ToxicFrog> | Hell, even drivers shouldn't always require a reboot, depending on the driver. |
| 16:53 | <@ToxicFrog> | I mean, the driver for the disk controller, maybe, but the network card? Sound? |
| 16:57 | <@Namegduf> | Linux isn't exactly a microkernel, but that's technically possible if you were to just update specific drivers and not the whole kernel at once. |
| 16:57 | <@Namegduf> | s/exactly // |
| 16:57 | <@jerith> | Unloading modules can be problematic. |
| 16:57 | <@Namegduf> | Yeah, that's the pain. |
| 16:57 | <@jerith> | Not worth the effort, generally. |
| 16:57 | <@Namegduf> | And why-yes. |
| 16:58 | <@Namegduf> | It's possible, but a mixture of not worth the effort, and almost as disruptive as a reboot. |
| 16:58 | <@jerith> | If it's necessary, your critical system is *way* too fragile. |
| 16:59 | <@Namegduf> | "I know, but I can't change how the uptime numbers go up without being accused of cheating! I need to keep this up or I'll be beaten by someone else!" |
| 16:59 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yeah. I'm just pointing out that while driver updates are usually part of kernel updates, they aren't always (see, for example, the virtualbox driver), and when they aren't a reboot usually isn't required. |
| 16:59 | <@Namegduf> | That said, my IRC client no longer handles UTF-8 or links longer than a screen width. |
| 16:59 | <@Namegduf> | It started freaking out after about a 71 days uptime. |
| 16:59 | <@Namegduf> | And I've not rebooted. |
| 17:00 | <@Namegduf> | Er, restarted, rather. |
| 17:00 | <@Namegduf> | And it's been five days. |
| 17:01 | <@jerith> | If uptime's your concern, you're already blasting new kernels to /proc/kcore or whatever. |
| 17:01 | <@Namegduf> | Haha. |
| 17:01 | <@Namegduf> | I'm considering /upgrade |
| 17:01 | <@Namegduf> | But I've historically found it doesn't work. |
| 17:01 | <@Namegduf> | I specifically know it doesn't work for SSL connections. |
| 17:02 | <@ToxicFrog> | What client is this? |
| 17:02 | <@Namegduf> | irssi |
| 17:02 | <@Namegduf> | Links don't wrap. |
| 17:02 | <@Namegduf> | Instead, they run off the right side of the screen and leave a blank line below. |
| 17:02 | <@Namegduf> | Said line is not filled in while changing windows. |
| 17:02 | <@Namegduf> | This results in messages appearing in the wrong window in hilarious or offputting arrangements. |
| 17:03 | <@ToxicFrog> | Whoops. |
| 17:03 | <@Namegduf> | UTF-8 also broke, and I have no idea why. |
| 17:03 | <@jerith> | Irssi doesn't do anything with links. Your terminal emulator does. |
| 17:03 | <@Namegduf> | It's also in screen, which could be partly responsible, but also has no reason to do what it did. |
| 17:03 | <@Namegduf> | irssi uses ncurses |
| 17:03 | <@Namegduf> | I believe wrapping within a box thing is its job. |
| 17:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | Linkifying is probably the TE's job, though. |
| 17:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | Does this only happen with links, or with any really long line? |
| 17:04 | <@Namegduf> | Sorry, I was unclear. |
| 17:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | 01234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789 01234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789 |
| 17:04 | <@Namegduf> | Any really long line containing no space-yes, that one did it. |
| 17:05 | <@Namegduf> | This means the symptom and bizarreness is links, but it isn't inherently the linkiness itself that's responsible. |
| 17:05 | <@Namegduf> | I've *no idea* what happened. |
| 17:06 | <@Namegduf> | Maybe irssi disagreed with some part of the system being updated under it. |
| 17:06 | <@Namegduf> | Maybe my "disappearing channels from channel configuration, but they come back if I save and reload" bug causes memory corruption. |
| 17:06 | <@Namegduf> | Maybe it and screen had a disagreement of some kind... really hard to figure out how to debug. |
| 17:07 | <@Namegduf> | Bleh, I'll /upgrade and hope it works |
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| 17:08 | <@Namegduf> | Wow. |
| 17:08 | <@jerith> | Did The Magic Happen? |
| 17:09 | <@Namegduf> | Well, it upgraded. |
| 17:09 | <@Namegduf> | And it worked, except for.. bizarre random garbage in status. |
| 17:09 | <@Namegduf> | Oh, I think I understand. |
| 17:09 | <@Namegduf> | It interpreted the SSL connections as non-SSL connections, perhaps. |
| 17:09 | <@Namegduf> | (They did, indeed, all drop) |
| 17:10 | <@Namegduf> | Now to see if the bug is gone. |
| 17:11 | <@Namegduf> | Nope. |
| 17:11 | <@Namegduf> | Still there. |
| 17:11 | <@Namegduf> | Bizarre. |
| 17:12 | <@jerith> | Ran 330 tests in 12.739s |
| 17:12 | <@Namegduf> | Nice. |
| 17:12 | <@jerith> | That would make me happier if the time was an order of magnitude smaller. |
| 17:12 | <@ToxicFrog> | "maybe irssi and screen had a disagreement, really hard to debug" basically describes all of my experience with irssi :/ |
| 17:12 | <@jerith> | There's also about 5s of setup that isn't counted there. |
| 17:13 | <@Namegduf> | I'll be really annoyed if *screen* is broken. |
| 17:13 | <@Namegduf> | More likely, I accidentallly fed it garbage at some point, and I "broke" the screen window. |
| 17:13 | | * Namegduf guesses he'll need to kill it and fully restart everything, so... whee. |
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| 17:14 | <@jerith> | Ran 330 tests in 14.565s |
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| 17:14 | <@jerith> | real 0m21.533s |
| 17:14 | <@jerith> | Some of those tests do a bunch of I/O. :-/ |
| 17:15 | <@jerith> | lantea:max_wait jerith$ ls src/domainservice/tests/stored_responses/ | wc -l |
| 17:15 | <@jerith> | 1427 |
| 17:15 | < Namegduf> | That fixed it. |
| 17:15 | <@jerith> | \o/ |
| 17:23 | <@ToxicFrog> | Woot. |
| 17:23 | | * ToxicFrog ended up fixing it by dropping irssi entirely and moving to NX, in the end. |
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| 18:11 | < Namegduf> | There is no graphical client that meets my usage requirments |
| 18:11 | < Namegduf> | I run with 36 permanent windows in irssi, but I have a lot of merged windows. |
| 18:11 | < Namegduf> | Total channels could be approaching 50 or 60. |
| 18:12 | < Namegduf> | I could use xirssi, I guess, but I'd rather not. |
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| 18:48 | <@Derakon> | An example of the kind of code cleanup efforts I've been making: http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/283 |
| 18:49 | <@Derakon> | This example doesn't even involve changing any algorithms; it's strictly a style cleanup. |
| 19:15 | <@ToxicFrog> | I'm kind of regretting not running 'git p4 sync' inside time now. |
| 19:15 | <@ToxicFrog> | I started it when I got in at 9 and it's 55% done. |
| 19:16 | <@Derakon> | ...git wraps p4 now? What? |
| 19:16 | <@ToxicFrog> | git-p4 is a third party Python script to allow communication between git and p4. |
| 19:16 | <@Derakon> | Ah. |
| 19:17 | <@ToxicFrog> | It works similarly to git-svn -- git p4 clone, git p4 sync && git merge (or git p4 rebase), git p4 submit. |
| 19:18 | <@ToxicFrog> | I've been hacking on it to make it actually works on our repos, which weigh multiple gigabytes and cause it problems since the original version buffered each checkout in memory entire. |
| 19:19 | <@Derakon> | Oops. |
| 19:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yeah. |
| 19:19 | <@jerith> | Eep. |
| 19:30 | | * Derakon sighs at the use of the variable name 'c'. |
| 19:30 | < celticminstrel> | Why? |
| 19:31 | <@Derakon> | Single-letter variable names are often unintuitive, and annoyingly hard to replace with something better. |
| 19:31 | <@Derakon> | "cc" was significantly easier to replace, for example. |
| 19:31 | < celticminstrel> | True, hard to replace. |
| 19:32 | <@Derakon> | I'm replacing 'c' with 'camId' (as 'cc' was replaced by 'camIds'). |
| 19:32 | | * gnolam actually uses it from time to time. |
| 19:32 | <@Derakon> | "it" is a terrible variable name. ?.? |
| 19:32 | < gnolam> | Although, only in shaders and only where it's blindingly obvious that it means "color". |
| 19:34 | < celticminstrel> | I think I usually use clr for colours.... |
| 19:34 | <@Derakon> | for c in range(len(lop)): |
| 19:34 | <@Derakon> | p = lop[c] |
| 19:34 | | * Derakon sighs. |
| 19:34 | | * Derakon beats Sebastian about the head with the "enumerate" function. |
| 19:34 | <@Derakon> | I usually use "col" or "color" for color. |
| 19:34 | <@Derakon> | (Usually I don't need to have columns and colors in the same context) |
| 19:35 | <@jerith> | I generally use "colour", because I'm curmudgeonly. |
| 19:35 | < celticminstrel> | Wouldn't it be easier to say "for c in lop" there? |
| 19:35 | <@Derakon> | Celticminstrel: yeah, except the index is actually needed. |
| 19:35 | <@Derakon> | (I didn't show the third line) |
| 19:35 | < celticminstrel> | Ah. |
| 19:35 | <@ToxicFrog> | You can't iterate over (index,key) ? |
| 19:35 | <@ToxicFrog> | Er, |
| 19:35 | <@ToxicFrog> | (index, value)? |
| 19:35 | <@Derakon> | New code: |
| 19:35 | <@Derakon> | for camId, port in enumerate(lop): |
| 19:35 | <@Derakon> | camSet(camId, port) |
| 19:35 | <@Vornicus> | for i,v in enumerate(pile) |
| 19:35 | <@ToxicFrog> | Oh, so you can |
| 19:35 | <@jerith> | ToxicFrog: enumerate() |
| 19:36 | < celticminstrel> | I'll have to remember that. |
| 19:36 | <@Derakon> | It's very handy. |
| 19:36 | | * Vornicus remembers when that was added. Was so happy. |
| 19:36 | | * jerith *really* wants a dict.update() equivalent that actually returns the updated dict. |
| 19:37 | <@Vornicus> | you want a copying merge? |
| 19:38 | <@jerith> | If you mean the equivalent of list + other_list (versus list.extend()), then yes. |
| 19:40 | | * jerith heads home. |
| 19:49 | <@McMartin> | In Java, that would be c = new HashMap(aMap).putAll(bMap), I think. |
| 19:49 | <@McMartin> | I forget if putAll returns this |
| 19:51 | <@Derakon> | It seems like you should be able to add dicts like you do lists. The only question would be what happens on a key conflict. |
| 19:51 | <@Derakon> | (Such addition is not supported, at least not in Python 2.5) |
| 19:52 | <@McMartin> | Yeah, putAll replaces |
| 19:52 | <@McMartin> | The Haskell standard library has you pass in a combining operation, which lets you do awesome and heinous functional things. |
| 20:05 | <@Derakon> | "Awesome and heinous" sounds pretty standard for functional programming~ |
| 20:06 | | * Derakon heads to lunch. |
| 20:17 | <@jerith> | I need a three-step "mydict = get_dict(); mydict.update(other_dict); return mydict" thing. |
| 20:17 | <@jerith> | Which is a pain. |
| 20:18 | <@McMartin> | How does update handle key conflicts? Auto-overwrite? |
| 20:18 | | * jerith nods. |
| 20:19 | <@jerith> | Quite often, I actually end up with "mydict = {}; mydict.update(defaults); mydict.update(params); do_something(mydict)" |
| 20:20 | <@jerith> | Because I don't want to overwrite defaults with stuff. |
| 20:20 | | * McMartin nods |
| 20:20 | <@McMartin> | Yeah |
| 20:20 | <@Vornicus> | mydict = dict(defaults) should do the same as those first two lines |
| 20:21 | | * jerith nods. |
| 20:43 | <@AnnoDomini> | Damn it. What's the Linux command to delete non-empty directories? |
| 20:44 | <@Vornicus> | rm -rf dir will do it. Be careful though! |
| 20:45 | <@Derakon> | Especially if you're deleting emacs temporary files... |
| 20:45 | <@Derakon> | "rm -rf * ~" is not the same thing as "rm -rf *~" |
| 20:45 | <@AnnoDomini> | I don't use emacs. |
| 20:45 | < celticminstrel> | The former will delete your entire home folder, right? |
| 20:45 | <@Derakon> | Yes. |
| 20:46 | < PinkFreud> | celticminstrel: and everything in the current directory |
| 20:46 | <@AnnoDomini> | I just want to de-virus my pendrive. |
| 20:46 | < celticminstrel> | PinkFreud: Which may or may not be part of your home folder. |
| 20:46 | <@Derakon> | Usually it is, though. |
| 20:46 | < PinkFreud> | celticminstrel: depends on where you currently are. |
| 20:47 | < celticminstrel> | Yes. |
| 20:47 | < celticminstrel> | I always used just "rm *~" to delete those files. Or "rm '#*#'" for the other kind. |
| 20:47 | <@Derakon> | Yeah, the -r isn't even very helpful here since it'll only traverse through directories that themselves end in ~ |
| 20:47 | <@Derakon> | But some people type "rm -rf" by reflex. |
| 20:47 | < celticminstrel> | I see. |
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| 20:52 | <@Derakon> | Sample line of code: |
| 20:52 | <@Derakon> | H.ccd_sub_bin(*(X.curCam_ccdSetImageArgs[:-1] + [allowAutoRestart])) # UGLY !! |
| 20:52 | <@Derakon> | (Note that isn't my comment) |
| 20:52 | <@Vornicus> | ;_; |
| 20:54 | <@McMartin> | =( |
| 20:55 | <@Derakon> | For those not strongly-versed in Python, what this is doing is passing a tuple as if it were the standard set of arguments for a function. |
| 20:55 | <@Derakon> | E.g. if you have a function foo(a, b, c), then you could call foo(*(1, 2, 3)), which would be the same as doing foo(1, 2, 3) directly. |
| 20:56 | < celticminstrel> | Which is quite useful actually. |
| 20:56 | <@jerith> | I do that often enough that it doesn't seem strange. |
| 20:56 | <@Derakon> | Mostly for inheritance. |
| 20:57 | <@Derakon> | If your child class doesn't care about arguments handed to the parent class (or only cares about a subset), you can lump the ones you don't care about into a "stick the rest of the arguments in this tuple" special argument, which you then pass to the parent constructor using this mechanism. |
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| 20:57 | <@jerith> | foo(**mydict) is also useful. |
| 20:58 | <@Derakon> | What do you use it for aside from "I don't care what these arguments are, but a function I call does" situations? |
| 20:59 | <@jerith> | I have a bunch of APIs that take lots of parameters. |
| 21:01 | <@jerith> | So I do something like what I was whinging about above and pass it in as **kwargs. |
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| 21:01 | <@Derakon> | How is that an improvement over just specifying the arguments in the function call directly? |
| 21:02 | <@jerith> | I get a dict of the non-defaults from elsewhere. |
| 21:02 | <@jerith> | It makes sense in context. |
| 21:03 | <@Derakon> | Ah. |
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| 21:03 | | mode/#code [+o AnnoDomini] by Reiver |
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| 21:28 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
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| 21:44 | <@Derakon> | Function ctpp for taking images with the camera imports the wx module so that it can access wx.CYAN. Function ftpp for taking images with the camera in a different fashion doesn't bother importing wx (even though it uses wx.GREEN), because it knows that wx was already imported at the module level. |
| 21:44 | <@Derakon> | Yay! |
| 21:44 | <@jerith> | Yay! </wrists> |
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| 21:47 | <@AnnoDomini> | Why... would you put XML brackets around... argh. This hurt my brain. |
| 21:51 | <@McMartin> | because it's the end of your wrists. |
| 21:52 | <@jerith> | "slash wrists" |
| 21:52 | <@McMartin> | I tend to actually read /wrists as an emote, though~ |
| 21:52 | <@AnnoDomini> | Yes, I know, but why the XML notation? Why not just "/wrists"? |
| 21:53 | <@Derakon> | As McM said, it's the end of your wrists. |
| 21:53 | < celticminstrel> | I don't get it. |
| 21:53 | <@Derakon> | Your <wrists> tag starts at your shoulders, and normally ends right before your <hands> tag. |
| 21:53 | < celticminstrel> | ... |
| 21:53 | <@Derakon> | Jerith is suggesting that it be ended early, presumably with a knife. |
| 21:53 | < celticminstrel> | Not really. |
| 21:54 | <@Derakon> | ...er. |
| 21:54 | <@Derakon> | Yes, I seem to have a poor grasp of anatomy today. |
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| 21:54 | <@McMartin> | Are you aware that "slashing one's wrists" is a form of suicide? |
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| 21:54 | <@McMartin> | That's an important bit of context~ |
| 21:54 | <@AnnoDomini> | I never quite understood how one could commit suicide by slashing one's wrists. |
| 21:54 | <@jerith> | 22:54 -!- Reiv[Graduate] [orthianz@Nightstar-43f07b21.xnet.co.nz] has joined #code |
| 21:54 | <@jerith> | 22:54 <@McMartin> Are you aware that "slashing one's wrists" is a form of suicide? |
| 21:54 | <@jerith> | 22:54 -!- Reiv[Graduate] [orthianz@Nightstar-43f07b21.xnet.co.nz] has quit [Client closed the connection] |
| 21:55 | <@McMartin> | (Though it's actually more "opening the arteries and veins in your forearm" |
| 21:55 | <@jerith> | That is oh so very awesome. |
| 21:55 | <@McMartin> | Rippy the Razor sez: down the block, not across the street! |
| 21:55 | <@AnnoDomini> | It seems wholly inadequate. And prolonged, if it works. |
| 21:55 | <@McMartin> | That's because you're thinking more across the street than down the block |
| 21:55 | <@AnnoDomini> | I seep. |
| 21:55 | <@Derakon> | If you cut along the arm, then you open up your veins pretty widely. |
| 21:55 | <@McMartin> | Yeah, that's because you didn't hit an artery |
| 21:55 | <@McMartin> | Then you'd gush |
| 21:55 | <@Derakon> | Blood loss is rapid at that point. |
| 21:56 | <@Derakon> | s/veins/arteries/, yeah. |
| 21:56 | <@McMartin> | It's probably as fast if not faster than having one's throat slit |
| 21:56 | <@jerith> | It isn't massively painful and it minimises mess if you do it in a warm bath. |
| 21:56 | <@McMartin> | Kids, don't try this at home |
| 21:56 | <@AnnoDomini> | Well, I don't actually have experience in the matter, not being suicidal or retarded. |
| 21:56 | <@Derakon> | Kids, don't try this. |
| 21:57 | <@McMartin> | I'm actually not sure if, say, a workshop accident could result in an arm wound equivalent to slitting your wrists |
| 21:57 | <@McMartin> | Speaking of not trying things at home |
| 21:57 | <@AnnoDomini> | I'm pretty sure it could, if you - say - are working with a file in a somewhat awkward position, and you miss whatever you meant to hit and instead run the file down the length of your forearm. |
| 21:58 | <@Derakon> | I could see you managing to really misuse a rotary saw. |
| 21:58 | <@Derakon> | Geeze, this is pretty morbid. |
| 21:59 | <@jerith> | If you want to bleed out fast, open the one in your thigh. |
| 21:59 | <@jerith> | That's pretty deep, though, and would hurt like... a thing that hurts a lot. |
| 22:00 | <@McMartin> | Yeah, it's the depth that makes me wonder how likely such an accident would be. |
| 22:00 | <@McMartin> | It seems like anything that could get that deep would probably just take your limb off |
| 22:00 | <@McMartin> | This is all on-topic because it's why we're much happier working solely in code instead of with tools |
| 22:00 | <@AnnoDomini> | Well, people routinely die from breaking their leg at the thigh. |
| 22:01 | <@AnnoDomini> | McMartin: Programmable workshop machines! :p |
| 22:02 | <@McMartin> | Which get to operate far, far away |
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| 22:02 | <@McMartin> | CNC is teh roxxor though, no fooling |
| 22:02 | <@jerith> | Quite. |
| 22:02 | <@AnnoDomini> | Reiv[Graduate]: Haldiel is being raised from dead. Please post. |
| 22:03 | <@Derakon> | I saw a pretty awesome video of a CNC machine milling a motorcycle helmet out of a solid block of aluminum. |
| 22:03 | <@McMartin> | <3 |
| 22:03 | <@AnnoDomini> | :D |
| 22:03 | <@AnnoDomini> | Link? |
| 22:03 | <@Derakon> | No idea, sorry. |
| 22:03 | <@Derakon> | And it wasn't a usable helmet, of course. |
| 22:03 | | * McMartin got to program a small one (wood carver) in 8th grade as part of Robotics Shop. |
| 22:04 | <@Derakon> | Ah, probably http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDPA06D1r_8 |
| 22:04 | <@McMartin> | Derakon: That would have been a horrible waste if it were |
| 22:14 | <@Derakon> | A bit under halfway through documenting the sebC module (for working with cameras), I find a function that takes an image and a cropbox and crops the image for you. |
| 22:14 | <@Derakon> | Which, yeah, I can see how it relates to cameras, but there's nothing in it actually dealing with the cameras. It's a generic image-processing function. |
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| 22:21 | <@Derakon> | testIfCamIsGoodConnected. *sigh* |
| 22:22 | <@Derakon> | (A function to validate that the connection to the camera is still open and the camera is responding) |
| 22:26 | | * McMartin watches his kernel debugger go to town ;_; |
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| 22:28 | <@Derakon> | Two selected lines from the codebase: |
| 22:28 | <@Derakon> | ''' |
| 22:28 | <@Derakon> | ''' |
| 22:28 | < celticminstrel> | ... |
| 22:28 | <@McMartin> | ... nothing intrinsically wrong with that, is it? That's an easily expandable here document that's currently "\n\t" |
| 22:29 | <@Derakon> | It's just pointless, is all. |
| 22:29 | <@McMartin> | Mmm |
| 22:29 | <@McMartin> | I mean, this is seb |
| 22:29 | <@McMartin> | But it's not intrinsically wrong. |
| 22:29 | <@McMartin> | I can see style guides that would want that in some cases |
| 22:30 | <@Derakon> | What, some combination of "every function must have a document string" and "don't comment obvious code"? |
| 22:30 | <@McMartin> | Though I'd personally prefer '''TODO: Write actual doc string''' for that |
| 22:30 | <@Derakon> | (Except this code isn't obvious at all...) |
| 22:30 | <@McMartin> | I could see a style guideline to never use escape codes if you can't help it |
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| 22:33 | | * McMartin watches his kernel debugger go to town ;_; |
| 22:35 | <@McMartin> | Oh, wait, it's not beign really slow. It's waiting for input. |
| 22:35 | | * McMartin logs in, hurrrrrr |
| 22:35 | <@Derakon> | Reminds me of when I set off a long-running recursive grep to go and forget to tell it what files to grep... |
| 22:36 | <@McMartin> | "Man, this is taking forever. At least my CPU usage is still OK..." |
| 22:37 | <@Derakon> | Pretty much, yep. |
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| 22:48 | <@McMartin> | OK, now it's acting deadlocked. |
| 22:48 | <@McMartin> | But I really have no idea how slow a Win7 debug kernel is supposed to be. |
| 22:49 | <@AnnoDomini> | Too slow. End its life. |
| 22:49 | <@McMartin> | It has not yet yielded up the data I seek |
| 22:50 | <@AnnoDomini> | (http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2007/11/5/) |
| 22:50 | <@Derakon> | Hey guys, validate input! http://www.cnbc.com/id/36999483 |
| 22:50 | <@McMartin> | I dunno, that looks like a valid input, just not the one they wanted |
| 22:51 | <@Derakon> | I'm suggesting you have a sanity check for unusual inputs. |
| 22:51 | <@Derakon> | I have some code in one section that says "Man, that's a big delay. You know this is in seconds, not milliseconds, right? Sure you want to go ahead?" |
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| 22:52 | <@McMartin> | That explains why the market rebounded so fast, at least. |
| 22:52 | <@McMartin> | Derakon: By then, you've lost FIVE BILLION DOLLARS IN MARGIN TRADES OMG OMZG |
| 22:54 | <@Derakon> | I do sometimes think it'd be a good idea to have a half-hour window in which trades are submitted, after which point they resolve simultaneously. Take some of the "OMG must be fast" out of it. |
| 22:54 | <@Derakon> | There's probably some good reason why it wouldn't work -- resolving simultaneity if nothing else -- but the current system is obviously broken. |
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| 23:35 | <@McMartin> | The current system was being gamed by major players so that they'd get info 2s before everyone else, and using that to skim off billions |
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| 23:53 | <@Derakon> | I'm about 60% of the way through cleaning up the style of a ~1k-line module...and the diff is now 1200 lines. |
| --- Log closed Fri May 07 00:00:54 2010 |