| --- Log opened Mon Jun 03 00:00:22 2013 |
| 00:01 | | Turaiel[Offline] is now known as Turaiel |
| 00:10 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 00:13 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
| 01:00 | | * Azash rubs at his eyes trying to understand the pumping lemma |
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| 02:31 | <@Azash> | Oh wow |
| 02:31 | <@Azash> | So this messy node.js project we did last autumn, the messiest part was the networking code |
| 02:32 | <@Azash> | Nobody has worked on it for around seven months |
| 02:32 | <@Azash> | ... Someone just opened a ticket about HTTPS networking being broken |
| 02:32 | | * Azash 's reaction is best summed up as "UHHHHHHHH" |
| 02:32 | <@Tamber> | It's rotted and collapsing in on itself? |
| 02:32 | <@Azash> | A decent analogy |
| 02:32 | <@Azash> | https://github.com/haeroe/jssanal/issues/2 |
| 02:33 | <@Tamber> | Alternatively, the mess of code has spawned a creature From The Beyond. |
| 02:40 | < VirusJTG__> | you called Tamber? |
| 02:41 | <@Tamber> | =) |
| 02:43 | < VirusJTG__> | now you know how I truely came into existance |
| 02:43 | < VirusJTG__> | sssshhhhhh |
| 02:44 | <@Azash> | VirusJTG__: I certainly hope it wasn't you who opened the ticket, hah |
| 02:45 | < VirusJTG__> | nope, not me |
| 02:50 | <@Azash> | Honestly at this point I would rather rewrite the project including AST parsing in C than wade back into node.js |
| 02:58 | <@gnolam> | https://mchankins.wordpress.com/2013/04/21/still-not-significant-2/ |
| 02:58 | <@gnolam> | Science: how not to do it. |
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| 10:24 | | * Vornicus gnargs at ridiculous criteria |
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| 11:10 | <~Vornicus> | there. Think that's the whole thing. Good god. |
| 11:12 | | * Vornicus has if (a) {if (aa) {...}} else if (b) {if (bb) {...}} else /* c */ {if (cc) {...}} |
| 11:13 | <@Azash> | if ( a && A ) etc? |
| 11:13 | <@Azash> | Er |
| 11:13 | <@Azash> | if (a && aa) |
| 11:18 | <~Vornicus> | nope. I have to avoid hitting cc's condition unless both a and b fail. |
| 11:20 | | Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody|out |
| 11:20 | <~Vornicus> | so cc's condition would become (!a && !b && cc) which gets a little silly. |
| 11:22 | < JBeshir> | Why not "else if (cc) { ... }"? |
| 11:22 | < JBeshir> | I'm pretty sure that's equivalent to what you wrote. |
| 11:22 | < JBeshir> | Aside that it seems fairly reasonable. |
| 11:23 | <~Vornicus> | guess it is. |
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| --- Log closed Mon Jun 03 11:31:35 2013 |
| --- Log opened Mon Jun 03 11:32:01 2013 |
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| 13:43 | | * iospace hats ToxicFrog |
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| 13:59 | <@iospace> | oh bloody hell, one line of code |
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| 14:22 | | * ToxicFrog hats iospace, creating a mutually recursive hat loop |
| 14:22 | | ToxicFrog is now known as ToxicFrog|W`rkn |
| 14:22 | <@iospace> | heh |
| 14:23 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | (personally, I find if (a && aa) else if (b && bb) else if (!a && !b && cc) to be more readable) |
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| 14:49 | | * iospace punches Asserts |
| 14:50 | <@TheWatcher> | ? |
| 14:51 | <@TheWatcher> | Asserts are pretty damned useful, as long as you're not just relyin on the bog-basic standard one |
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| 15:05 | <@iospace> | ... |
| 15:06 | <@iospace> | TheWatcher[afk]: theres reasons why i'm punching these |
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| 15:57 | <@froztbyte> | just reasons, or Reasons? |
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| 18:42 | | * iospace kicks SMBus |
| 18:44 | | Harlow [Harlow@Nightstar-864f834a.mycingular.net] has joined #code |
| 18:46 | < Harlow> | quick question to any of you who know javascript, getting data from a form option would look like this, var myvar = document.myform.mySelect.options[document.myform.mySelect.selectedIndex].value; how would I get my own data option Apperantly I can't just change ".value" to say ".data-mydata" |
| 18:46 | | * iospace doesn't use jscript, is too low level for that :P |
| 18:48 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Harlow: what do you mean by "your own data option"? |
| 18:49 | < Harlow> | say i have an option in a form for example <option value="1" data-mydata="hi"> option 1 </option> |
| 18:49 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | So you want to get the value of an arbitrary attribute? |
| 18:49 | < Harlow> | how could i retrieve the value of mydata? |
| 18:49 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | document...getAttribute("data-mydata") |
| 18:49 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | http://www.w3schools.com/jsref/met_element_getattribute.asp |
| 18:52 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | .value is part of the DOM standard for <option>; you can't just get arbitrary HTML tag attributes as js object properties (what happens when someone does <select options="foo">?). So, to manipulate attributes, you use the various (get|set|has|remove)Attribute*() methods. |
| 18:57 | <@sshine> | ToxicFrog|W`rkn, do browsers allow you to set arbitrary attributes for any DOM? |
| 18:59 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | sshine: yes; attributes are basically an arbitrary (string => string) map |
| 18:59 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Stuff that the browser doesn't understand it'll just ignore and it's up to JS to care about it |
| 19:01 | | * iospace hugs Harlow |
| 19:01 | <@iospace> | i don't get any of what you guys are saying |
| 19:01 | <@iospace> | :< |
| 19:02 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | iospace: welcome to browserside javascript development |
| 19:02 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Or, as it's more commonly known |
| 19:02 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | DIS, THE WOEFUL CITY AT THE HEART OF HELL |
| 19:02 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Enjoy your stay! |
| 19:03 | <@iospace> | i'll stay in smbus land |
| 19:03 | <@iospace> | thank you :P |
| 19:07 | < Harlow> | Thanks toxic! you solved my problem. :) |
| 19:07 | <@iospace> | Harlow: also, stay a while! we don't byte |
| 19:07 | | * iospace runs |
| 19:08 | | * Tamber pelts iospace with 7 bits. |
| 19:08 | <@iospace> | Tamber: you know thats the size of an i2c address, right? |
| 19:08 | <@Tamber> | Nope. :) |
| 19:08 | <@Tamber> | Well, *now* I do. |
| 19:08 | <@iospace> | :P |
| 19:12 | <@iospace> | aw bollocks |
| 19:12 | | * iospace thinks she's blocking the i2c port with her code by mistake Dx |
| 19:16 | < Harlow> | iospace are you coding in C++? |
| 19:16 | <@iospace> | C |
| 19:16 | | * iospace is more or less the resident low-level/embedded dev |
| 19:17 | < Harlow> | What are yo coding right now if you don't mind me asking |
| 19:18 | <@iospace> | an onboard test, can't go into much else |
| 19:19 | <@iospace> | yup, definitely mucking up the bus |
| 19:25 | | Harlow [Harlow@Nightstar-864f834a.mycingular.net] has quit [Client closed the connection] |
| 19:31 | <@iospace> | aw, they left :< |
| 19:42 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | :( |
| 20:15 | < RichyB> | Sometimes we nibble a bit, though. |
| 20:26 | | Turaiel[Offline] is now known as Turaiel |
| 20:31 | | * iospace sighs |
| 20:31 | <@iospace> | ok, so i just got confirmation that it /works/ somewhat |
| 20:31 | <@iospace> | but mucks up the bus? |
| 20:32 | <@iospace> | i dunno |
| 20:39 | | Kindamoody|out is now known as Kindamoody |
| 21:06 | <&McMartin> | Man, even though it's a typo, and one where the keys really are next to each other... |
| 21:07 | <&McMartin> | "gir pull" should really reply with something like "Squirrel: seen" |
| 21:07 | <@sshine> | hmm |
| 21:07 | <&McMartin> | iospace: I'm a bad person |
| 21:08 | <&McMartin> | I still can't see the entirely perfectly good technical term for what you write without giggling |
| 21:08 | <&McMartin> | Because "bus driver" has a stronger link elsewhere in the world of meaning |
| 21:08 | | * sshine has to decide between a 3-month TA job doing Haskell, Erlang and Prolog, and a long-term C# job doing websites using a ten-year-old web framework for large corporations. |
| 21:08 | <&McMartin> | sshine: Ouch |
| 21:08 | <@iospace> | McMartin: :V |
| 21:09 | <@iospace> | anyway |
| 21:09 | <@iospace> | i'm off |
| 21:09 | <@iospace> | later guys! |
| 21:09 | <&McMartin> | Ta-ta |
| 21:09 | | * iospace will cya all tomorrow :P |
| 21:09 | <&McMartin> | My mistake |
| 21:09 | <&McMartin> | Ta-ta for now |
| 21:09 | <&McMartin> | *scare chord throughout 100-acre wood* |
| 21:10 | <&McMartin> | sshine: I'm old; I hadn't realized there *were* 10-year-old C# frameworks |
| 21:10 | <@sshine> | McMartin, yeah. I so much want to choose the one that will result in fun, but I hate having to find a new job in three months and it probably will be another TA job, so I never get any long-term stuff on my resume. |
| 21:10 | <&McMartin> | What are the chances of you lasting more than a year in the long-term one? |
| 21:11 | <&McMartin> | If you expect to burn out in like six months *anyway* it's an easier choice, I guess? |
| 21:11 | <@sshine> | McMartin, the oldest code in the repo is from 2003. |
| 21:11 | <@sshine> | ummm |
| 21:11 | <@sshine> | well |
| 21:11 | <@sshine> | I *did* burn out in it after 6 months, turned sick and never really got back with them. after a year they called me and asked if I was still interested in working for them. ;) |
| 21:12 | <@sshine> | (I did actually get sick. but after I got better after a couple of months, I didn't go back) |
| 21:13 | <@sshine> | but I'm unsure what my chances are of only doing fun things once I'm done if I don't get a PhD. |
| 21:14 | <&McMartin> | Even if you do, afterwards you won't get to only do fun things~ |
| 21:14 | | Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody[zZz] |
| 21:15 | <@sshine> | right. there's always C# jobs waiting. *sigh* (C# is really kind of nice. it's having to do websites for people who don't care about websites.) |
| 21:16 | <&McMartin> | (Yeah. I'm just starting to deal with C# from an application-software standpoint and I'm willing to call it best-in-class for that style of language.) |
| 21:16 | <@sshine> | I had an interview at this event my department hold for companies. the company did "software for the insurance industry" and I've been considering getting into financial math stuff because I hope the companies use functional programming for it. turns out this one didn't, and he spent 20 minutes avoiding that fact. :P |
| 21:16 | <&McMartin> | (I'm willing to admit that Scala might be able to beat it at its own game) |
| 21:16 | <&McMartin> | Heh |
| 21:17 | <@sshine> | I'd dig an APL job! |
| 21:17 | <@sshine> | (I think) |
| 21:18 | <@sshine> | this company, SimCorp, built some type system around it. |
| 21:18 | <@sshine> | some programming-by-contract type header comments that their compiler checks. |
| 21:19 | <@sshine> | and then there's people who make websites in PHP for hair dressers, same education. |
| 21:20 | <@sshine> | they said it'd really boost my resume if I had had a C# job for a while. |
| 21:21 | <@sshine> | I'm doing some course projects about concurrent FP on GPUs and hoping that will look impressive |
| 21:23 | | * McMartin nods |
| 21:24 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | McMartin: I prefer Scala as a language, but last I checked Scala.NET was dead in the water, which means releasing everything as a jar, which means supporting windows will make you want to die. |
| 21:24 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | So I can easily believe that C# is the current best of breed~ |
| 21:25 | <&McMartin> | Heh. Fair enough |
| 21:25 | <&McMartin> | That said, I meant from a langauge design standpoint since we're also throwing Haskell and friends around here and there's no comparison at that point in terms of "get a shippable product"[*] |
| 21:25 | <&McMartin> | [* Except when you can in which case it's fine, see also The Surly Beard of Mrifk] |
| 21:26 | <&McMartin> | [[Mrifk being the Glulx decompiler that was (a) written in Haskell and (b) buggy, which is why I learned Haskell]] |
| 21:26 | <&jerith> | F#? |
| 21:26 | <&jerith> | Sorry, no context. Just saw Scala and C# near each other. |
| 21:27 | <&McMartin> | The later versions of C# actually looted a lot of F#'s good bits |
| 21:27 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | (this reminds me, I need to give clojure-clr another shot, now that it's officially supported and stuff) |
| 21:27 | <&McMartin> | (Oh hey, it is?) |
| 21:27 | <&McMartin> | (zomg) |
| 21:28 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | (it's in the clojure/ namespace on github now, is maintained by RH, and has version parity with mainline clojure) |
| 21:29 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | (although I guess you can't call it truly supported until lein ships with support for it built in~) |
| 21:42 | <@gnolam> | sshine: financial software tends to be clusterfucks built around ancient toolchains. |
| 21:44 | <&McMartin> | TF: I wonder if XNA/MonoGame can be bound from ClojureCLR |
| 21:45 | <@sshine> | gnolam, bank software, surely. |
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| 21:49 | < RichyB> | McMartin: there was an open source project that tried to reimplement MonoGame. |
| 21:49 | < RichyB> | I don't know how well it works. |
| 21:49 | < RichyB> | The only exposure that I have to it is that I once tried to use it as a drop-in to get Terraria to run under Mono on Linux. |
| 21:50 | < RichyB> | That didn't work, but I'm not really surprised because ABI compatibility is Hard, Dammit. |
| 21:50 | < RichyB> | OTOH what you're actually shooting for with an implementation like that is "it's feasible to build x-platform games with this", not "existing games definitely work perfectly." |
| 21:50 | <&McMartin> | Yeah, MonoGame isn't drop-in, if only because it lives in a different namespace |
| 21:50 | <&McMartin> | And it's good enough for Bastion~ |
| 21:50 | < RichyB> | er |
| 21:51 | < RichyB> | Ah, cool. |
| 21:51 | < RichyB> | Bastion is XNA? |
| 21:51 | <&McMartin> | Pretty sure. |
| 21:51 | <&McMartin> | It's definitely MonoGame on Linux. |
| 21:51 | <&McMartin> | And it started on XBLA. |
| 22:01 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| --- Log closed Mon Jun 03 22:19:38 2013 |
| --- Log opened Mon Jun 03 22:19:45 2013 |
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| --- Log closed Mon Jun 03 22:22:21 2013 |
| --- Log opened Mon Jun 03 22:23:37 2013 |
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| 22:31 | <@sshine> | gnolam, I'm hoping there is some other sort of insurance software that actually involves mathematical modelling and not just keeping track of customers and how much they're paying. |
| 22:32 | <@gnolam> | And whatever it is, it was probably developed in-house by a non-programmer. Where the best you can hope for is FORTRAN. :) |
| 22:33 | <@sshine> | I've a friend who is making a DSL for actuaries. |
| 22:42 | < RichyB> | McMartin: vague surprise; my first experiences of XNA games were Magicka and one of my university classmates' school projects. |
| 22:43 | < RichyB> | Hence I kinda associate "XNA game" with "really frigging slow and laggy", despite the fact that Bastion isn't. |
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| 22:54 | <&McMartin> | I think Bastion had a programmer team of larger than two~ |
| 22:56 | <@celticminstrel> | Bastion is for me. <_< |
| 22:56 | <@celticminstrel> | But then, that's not Bastion's fault. |
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| 23:20 | < RichyB> | Bastion also had a music team consisting of one god and one archon~ |
| 23:32 | <@gnolam> | o/` Gods ain't gonna help you son, you'll be sorry for what you've done o/` |
| 23:36 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 23:36 | | Harlow [Harlow@Nightstar-a784d8b0.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [[NS] Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] |
| 23:43 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
| 23:48 | <&McMartin> | In case of trouble, break glass, and, indeed, everything, with your Cael Hammer |
| --- Log closed Mon Jun 03 23:54:54 2013 |
| --- Log opened Mon Jun 03 23:55:01 2013 |
| 23:55 | | TheWatcher[zZzZ] [chris@Nightstar-3762b576.co.uk] has joined #code |
| 23:55 | | Irssi: #code: Total of 38 nicks [16 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 22 normal] |
| 23:55 | | mode/#code [+o TheWatcher[zZzZ]] by ChanServ |
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| 23:57 | <@gnolam> | :) |
| 23:57 | | * Vornicus gets back to fiddling with his C++ code, a thing he doesn't do nearly enough |
| 23:58 | <@gnolam> | It's a track on the Bastion soundtrack that (IIRC) didn't make it into the actual game. Which is a shame, because it's awesome: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s3b5OR2YhE |
| 23:58 | < RichyB> | It would have been perfect if it'd been tacked onto the end of the credits. |
| 23:59 | < RichyB> | I don't think that there was really any sensible place to put it in the main game itself. |
| --- Log closed Tue Jun 04 00:00:31 2013 |