| --- Log opened Fri May 10 00:00:46 2013 |
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| 04:29 | <~Vornicus> | ...depth first is better. There are situations where finding /one/ solution tells me about the validity of that puzzle; if one of the strands touches itself or there's a hole, then we know that the puzzle isn't a valid one because of multiple or gappy solutions. |
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| 09:14 | <~Vornicus> | (because in the absence of holes, breadth-first reaches all the solutions as its very last steps through the solution tree; depth first will hit one pretty early on) |
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| 11:20 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Vornicus: Are you making a search framework or something? |
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| 11:22 | <~Vornicus> | Yeah. I'm searching for all the numberlink puzzles of particular size |
| 11:23 | <~Vornicus> | (such that there are no non-trivial links, only one solution, and that solution has no empty squares) |
| 11:35 | <~Vornicus> | One component of this is the solver: I need to find the soluion(s). Reason for this is twofold: obviously I need to find the ones with solutions, but the existence of even an invalid solution says that you may be able to add another number pair to the puzzle. |
| 11:39 | <~Vornicus> | I chose depth-first because it gets me the first solution as early as possible. If a solution manages to meet certain conditions - the existence of a hole, or a strand that touches itself - I know that 1. the board given is not a good board but 2. there might be more complicated boards starting with this one that are good boards. |
| 12:06 | | * TheWatcher eyes work, eyes this database schema |
| 12:06 | | * TheWatcher sighs |
| 12:10 | <@TheWatcher> | I wonder what it's like to develop systems and /not/ have the requirements change. Got so used to that happening that I'm instinctively trying to predict all likely changes and set up everything accordingly. |
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| 17:10 | | * Derakon ponders display code for Pyrel, and how that interacts with the engine and the "content code". |
| 17:11 | <&Derakon> | The game engine makes few assumptions about how the game works -- mostly that there are creatures and items and creatures can carry/equip items, stuff like that. |
| 17:11 | <&Derakon> | Game logic is all handled in the "content code", which currently exists solely as a series of scripts that are invoked when trigger conditions are met. |
| 17:11 | <&Derakon> | So e.g. monster AI is a script that is invoked when the monster's update() function is called. |
| 17:12 | <&Derakon> | This works fine as long as I'm permuting the game world, but it falls down a bit when it comes time to permute the display. |
| 17:12 | <&Derakon> | For example, ideally I'd like a script that describes what stats should be displayed on-screen (e.g. player HP, STR/INT/WIS/DEX/CON/CHA, etc.). |
| 17:13 | <&Derakon> | But I can't think of a way to do that that's not hacky... |
| 17:14 | <&Derakon> | I mean, I could allow the UI layer to "reserve" chunks of the display for custom overlays, and then attach a script to the player creature that tells a reserved chunk what to show -- but then I've made assumptions about how the display layer works. |
| 17:14 | <&Derakon> | (Ideally I'd like to be able to replace the display layer with e.g. a first-person 3D renderer without having to change any code elsewhere) |
| 17:15 | <&Derakon> | On the flipside, I could have the display layer just inherently assume that there are stats it needs to show...but then if the game content changes, the display code also has to be changed. |
| 17:15 | <&Derakon> | Is there even a good solution here? Mumble mutter... |
| 17:27 | <&Derakon> | Mph, I guess the fundamental issue is that I need either display code that knows about the game, or game code that knows about the display, and both options are somewhat distasteful. Damn. |
| 17:28 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | I don't think there is - the display layer needs to know what stats etc it is to show, because this will be different depending on what interface you're using. |
| 17:28 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Even if the "important" stats are the same, how and when they're displayed will be different depending on whether you're doing a touchscreen interface vs. tty vs KBM tiled vs. 3d or whatever |
| 17:28 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Yeah, pretty much that |
| 17:28 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Of those, I think display code needing to know about the game is the lesser of those evils |
| 17:28 | <&Derakon> | You're probably right. |
| 17:29 | <&Derakon> | It saves having to create a bunch of interfaces between the game and display layers just so that the game can tell the display how to show things. |
| 17:29 | <&Derakon> | Must go to a meeting now. BBL. |
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| 18:17 | <&Derakon> | Always nice to have one of these group meetings where I actually understand what people are talking about. >.> |
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| 20:12 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | TIL that if syslogd hangs you are completely, irrevocably fucked. |
| 20:13 | <@froztbyte> | rofl |
| 20:13 | <@froztbyte> | it's pretty fun, isn't it? |
| 20:13 | <@froztbyte> | there's a couple of things in systems which we take for granted, and when they 'splode.. |
| 20:13 | <@froztbyte> | (another fun one: have a broken switchroot that doesn't pivot right) |
| 20:16 | < RichyB> | ToxicFrog|W`rkn: really? Aww. |
| 20:16 | < RichyB> | I thought you were supposed to communicate with syslogd so that messages would get dropped instead. |
| 20:16 | < RichyB> | Or is that only for when you're talking to a remote syslogd? |
| 20:16 | < RichyB> | Er, communicate with syslogd via UDP. |
| 20:19 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | RichyB: well, here's the issue. |
| 20:19 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | If syslogd is still up, but hung, attempts to write to /dev/log will block forever. |
| 20:19 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | (if you're talking to a remote syslog it's fine, the request will time out) |
| 20:19 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Anyways, this means that anything that attempts to log events will also block forever. |
| 20:20 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Like your mail server. |
| 20:20 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Or sshd. |
| 20:20 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Or sudo |
| 20:20 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | In particular, if you don't already have a root shell, you now have no way of getting one. |
| 20:27 | < RichyB> | Bummer. |
| 20:27 | < RichyB> | Is there a rationale for blocking the process trying to write to /dev/log rather than throwing the message away? |
| 20:28 | < RichyB> | Wait, back up. How did you even manage to hang syslogd? |
| 20:28 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | And I don't have /proc/sysrq-trigger user-writeable, for obvious reasons. |
| 20:28 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | I have no idea! /dev/log has a pretty big buffer, I have no idea how long it was hung for before stuff actually stopped working. |
| 20:28 | < RichyB> | :( |
| 20:29 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | The rationale is that UNIX domain sockets are meant to lossless, like named pipes. If you want nonblocking or timeout operation you have to explicitly set it up. |
| 20:29 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | For syslogd specifically, you don't want to lose potentially important messages because syslogd is waiting on disk as it flushes 40k of debug output from sshd -vvv or something. |
| 20:31 | < RichyB> | Yeah, but /dev/log is a ohhh wait, it's a socket. |
| 20:32 | < RichyB> | I misread the output of "ls" and thought that it was a character device. |
| 20:32 | < RichyB> | If it were the latter then it would've been possible to have a kernel policy for sometimes dropping messages so that the system can be brought back. |
| 20:34 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | As it is I think I'm going to have to wait until I get home and then hook up a keyboard and sysrq it. |
| 20:34 | < RichyB> | Ah well. Control-Alt-F1 to get to a real VTY, then control-alt-delete to get the system to cleanly reboot? Save your filesystem. |
| 20:34 | < RichyB> | Oh, remote machine. |
| 20:34 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | Yeah. And I don't think I have CAD set up to reboot it. |
| 20:35 | <&ToxicFrog|W`rkn> | CASrREISUB should work, though. |
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| --- Log closed Sat May 11 00:00:00 2013 |