| --- Log opened Sun Nov 16 00:00:19 2008 |
| 01:05 | | Consul [~consul@Nightstar-5023.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] |
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| 01:20 | | mode/#code [+o Consul] by ChanServ |
| 01:34 | <@Consul> | New Echo MiaMIDI sound card running audio - check. Now I need to figure out how to test MIDI. |
| 01:35 | <@Consul> | I tested MIDI under Windows and confirmed it works, so my equipment should not be a variable. |
| 02:16 | <@gnorevolution> | McMartin: they're still defective. |
| 02:16 | | gnorevolution is now known as gnolam |
| 02:22 | <@McMartin> | Is this in the "DFW" sense, or in the "Does not support my ATI-only extensions" sense? |
| 02:42 | <@gnolam> | In the "defective solder makes the cards break within months" sense. |
| 02:54 | <@gnolam> | So if you're gonna upgrade today, the choice is basically between defective hardware or defective software. :P |
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| 04:36 | <@Consul> | Okay, query: A friend of mine's network is sick. Symptoms: One laptop can see all other computers but cannot connect to any of them, all other computers on the network (including the print server) randomly appear and disappear when the network is viewed on any particular machine. This has happened with two different brands of router, both new. Differential diagnosis? |
| 04:37 | <@Consul> | Can you tell I've been watching way too much House? |
| 04:38 | <@GeekSoldier> | Operating systems? |
| 04:39 | <@Consul> | Windows XP and Suse 10.3, print server is one of those embedded standalone jobbies. |
| 04:39 | <@GeekSoldier> | ane does the subject have any history of drug use? |
| 04:39 | <@GeekSoldier> | haha. |
| 04:40 | <@Consul> | Current router's a Belkin Wireless-N. I don't know the exact model. |
| 04:41 | <@Consul> | Wait... |
| 04:41 | <@Consul> | Current router is: Belkin F5D8236-4v1(01) |
| 04:41 | <@Consul> | Previous router was a Linksys. |
| 04:45 | <@Consul> | Anyway, if anyone has any ideas on what to check next, I'll pass them along. |
| 04:45 | <@Consul> | I'm out of ideas. |
| 04:46 | <@Consul> | We've been over the cables, wireless interference, all of the stuff I can think of. |
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| 05:10 | <@jerith> | Bugger. |
| 05:10 | <@jerith> | I want working tests before I refactor. |
| 05:10 | <@jerith> | Except a bunch of the stuff is broken, so a handful of tests will never pass. |
| 05:10 | <@jerith> | To fix them, I need to refactor. |
| 05:10 | <@jerith> | :-( |
| 05:13 | <@GeekSoldier> | d'oh! |
| 05:13 | <@jerith> | I've put in a nasty hack that will make them work. |
| 05:13 | <@jerith> | Suudenly thought of it now. |
| 05:14 | <@jerith> | This code scares me. |
| 05:14 | <@GeekSoldier> | ignore the test result until after the refactor? |
| 05:14 | <@jerith> | That defeats the point of having the tests. |
| 05:15 | <@Vornicus> | Just Don't Break Anything while you're refactoring |
| 05:15 | <@GeekSoldier> | yes. wow. (/me blames Pitr) |
| 05:15 | <@Vornicus> | You know the tests fail; you know you can't fix it until you refactor. |
| 05:15 | <@jerith> | I'm happy to put in temporary hack-fixes for stuff that's actually broken. |
| 05:15 | <@Vornicus> | Therefore... |
| 05:15 | <@jerith> | Vornicus: Then there's noise and it's far more difficult to find new stuff that's broken. |
| 05:16 | <@jerith> | I'm not refactoring yet, just writing the tests. |
| 05:17 | <@jerith> | In this case, the bug is that the code thinks inner classes (in Ruby) get inherited. Apparently they don't. |
| 05:20 | <@jerith> | http://paste.ubuntu.com/72717/ <-- Like so. |
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| 23:07 | <@gnolam> | Explain to me how someone can think that a 60 second cooldown /plus/ and anti-captcha (so unreadable you'll _need_ a computer to crack it!) on a forum search is a good thing. |
| 23:08 | <@gnolam> | In fact, explain to me the need for search captchas at all. |
| 23:08 | <@Consul> | How about captchas in general. |
| 23:08 | <@Consul> | I mean, I understand the idea in theory, but... |
| 23:08 | <@McMartin> | Searching is expensive, captchaing it opens you to DoS |
| 23:08 | <@McMartin> | Consul: The theory is a reaction to astonishingly brutal practice. |
| 23:09 | <@gnolam> | So do the timeout thing. |
| 23:09 | <@Consul> | McMartin: But the captchas always get cracked anyway. And they're no good against a force of low-paid foreign outsourcing firms anyway. |
| 23:09 | <@McMartin> | gnolam: Still open to DDoS. |
| 23:10 | <@gnolam> | And the captcha helps that how? |
| 23:10 | <@McMartin> | gnolam: Your 50 million zombies can't actually submit the search. |
| 23:10 | <@gnolam> | Eh? |
| 23:10 | <@McMartin> | Consul: outsourcers post about a million times slower than an army of zombies and are totally useless for click-fraud. |
| 23:11 | <@McMartin> | gnolam: The attack it's defending against is someone using their zombie network of several million computers to all submit search requests simultaneously, wrecking the server. |
| 23:11 | <@gnolam> | Ah. |
| 23:11 | <@gnolam> | So limit the maximum amount of search connections to the database then... |
| 23:11 | <@McMartin> | Granted, with a large enough zombie network you can wreck them just by requesting the forms/captchas themselves, but. |
| 23:11 | <@gnolam> | Anything is better than ridiculous bloody captchas. |
| 23:12 | <@gnolam> | Yes Valve, I'm looking at you. |
| 23:12 | <@McMartin> | I've actually never seen anyone annoyed by captchas. |
| 23:12 | <@Vornicus> | Searches are the most process-intensive things on a forum. |
| 23:13 | <@gnolam> | McMartin: try this one for size: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/search.php |
| 23:13 | <@McMartin> | Maybe it's because I've been on fora that have been flooded by signal-to-noise ratios of 1,000 to 1 with spam that isn't even intended for human beings, just executing click fraud |
| 23:13 | <@gnolam> | Run at a sufficiently high resolution and you're SOL. |
| 23:13 | <@gnolam> | When you need to reload a captcha 10 times to get something readable to you, you're using a severely flawed implementation. |
| 23:14 | <@McMartin> | I fail to see how this is a condemnation of captchas in general. |
| 23:14 | <@McMartin> | Which is what you're delivering here. |
| 23:14 | <@McMartin> | That said, all you need to be for this one is colorblind. |
| 23:17 | < Alek|away> | I've been annoyed by captchas. a lot. >_< |
| 23:18 | < Alek|away> | certain implementations are worse than useless - they're actually harmful. |
| 23:25 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
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| --- Log closed Mon Nov 17 00:00:31 2008 |