code logs -> 2008 -> Fri, 10 Oct 2008< code.20081009.log - code.20081011.log >
--- Log opened Fri Oct 10 00:00:39 2008
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02:59
<@Consul>
Fantastic!
03:00
<@Consul>
I had forgotten how sweet rsync is.
03:03
< Vornicus>
rsync is your tiny god.
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--- Log closed Fri Oct 10 03:28:51 2008
--- Log opened Fri Oct 10 03:28:56 2008
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03:31
<@GeekSoldier>
Sounds like a Fear Factory cover band to me.
03:31 * Vornicus offers up Toilet Paper Meteorite as a band.
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03:33
< Shoukanjuu>
Umbrella Chronicles >.>
03:33
<@Consul>
You can string any random words together and get a band name.
03:33
<@Consul>
Heliotrope Momentum
03:34
<@McMartin>
Recalcitrant Pumpkin.
03:34
<@Consul>
The Twinkle Gourds
03:35
<@Consul>
Hop the Snowman
03:35
< Shoukanjuu>
One one?
03:35
< Shoukanjuu>
One One. >_>
03:35 * McMartin objected to the Umbrella Chronicles. Instead of being a deadly smackdown starring Princess Peach and The Penguin, it was a shittily-balanced rail shooter.
03:35
< Shoukanjuu>
IT'S A FINE GAME, especially because I didn't pay for it past the what, 12 cent DVD I burnet it to?
03:36
<@McMartin>
Nope.
03:37
<@McMartin>
There's no excuse whatsoever for having the first boss have a one-shot attack with a lead-time of less than your reload time.
03:37
< Shoukanjuu>
I don't remember the first boss having a one shot attack.
03:37
< Shoukanjuu>
Wait, wait.
03:37
< Shoukanjuu>
Yes I do.
03:37
<@McMartin>
The first boss has a one-shot attack.
03:37
<@McMartin>
We timed it.
03:37
< Shoukanjuu>
But I killed him before it happened
03:37
< Shoukanjuu>
With the handgun no less.
03:37
< Shoukanjuu>
With the handgun no less
03:37
<@McMartin>
It can in fact start in the middle of a reload and kill you before you get input back.
03:37
<@McMartin>
LBM.
03:38
< Shoukanjuu>
Mm.
03:38
<@McMartin>
FAIL.
03:38
<@Consul>
I was having more fun with band names. :-/
03:38
<@McMartin>
Band Name Alert: Luck Based Mission
03:38
<@Consul>
Hehe
03:38
< Shoukanjuu>
Not only that, but it's possible to time knife strikes to hit him when he hits you.
03:38
<@Consul>
Courtney Cockerel?
03:38
<@McMartin>
Shoukanjuu: NOT IF YOU'RE RELOADING IT'S NOT.
03:38
<@Consul>
Could be a punk band.
03:38
<@McMartin>
Unless there was a stop reloading button that wasn't in the manual.
03:39
< Shoukanjuu>
Whose fault is that? You could switch to another weapon and gun gun gun
03:39
<@McMartin>
The game designer's.
03:39
< Shoukanjuu>
Other than that, any other problems?
03:39
<@McMartin>
That's sufficient to kill the game immediately, in fact.
03:40
< Shoukanjuu>
Or could you just not get past the first level because of the game breaking one hit kill >_>
03:40
<@McMartin>
But it's a particularly nasty instance of "reloading takes way the fuck too long and you can't interrupt it to adapt to circumstances, which is utter bullshit"
03:40
<@McMartin>
And well in keeping with RE, which I hate with a passion for this general reason.
03:40
<@McMartin>
THe principle of the series is "Let's artificially force the player to do fucking stupid things and punish him for it!"
03:41
< Shoukanjuu>
which games can you not reload in your inventory screen? >_>
03:41
< Shoukanjuu>
I know you can in 0 and 4
03:41
< Shoukanjuu>
I never needed to in 1 and 2
03:41
<@McMartin>
Umbrella Chronicles
03:41
< Shoukanjuu>
Didn't play any others >_>
03:41
<@McMartin>
However, in 2, all over the place, the camera will be in the hero's face so that he cannot see that there is a Zombie RIGHT IN FRONT OF HIM
03:41
<@McMartin>
And so you, who cannot see it, walk down an empty hall and get mauled.
03:41
< Shoukanjuu>
Hehe, I remember that.
03:41
<@McMartin>
This would not happen with a chasecam because it's, you know, right in front of his fucking face
03:42
< Shoukanjuu>
Those crazy people XD
03:42
<@McMartin>
So, yeah.
03:42
<@McMartin>
It's a game design principle based on, imo, cheating.
03:42
<@McMartin>
And it's not classy about it.
03:43
<@McMartin>
It's saying "HA HA, FOOLED YOU!" in a mystery by having a character introduced only in the last page have actually done it.
03:43
< Shoukanjuu>
Well, okay.
03:43
<@McMartin>
Eternal Darkness is classy about it.
03:43
< Shoukanjuu>
I can agree with you on that.
03:43
< Shoukanjuu>
On both of the latter accounts, including ED
03:44
<@McMartin>
Then, you add to that that my stack of games to play is already like 12 tall, and I don't need to make it taller with games that won't respect me in the morning =P
03:45
<@McMartin>
That said, I give RE credit for being the original source for the DMC series.
03:45
< Shoukanjuu>
The handgun is reload in one shot
03:45
<@McMartin>
DMC1 has some issues with "how hard it is depends on how severely you exploit the metagame and it is not obvious that you are intended to do this"
03:46
<@McMartin>
DMC2 nobody talks about
03:46
<@McMartin>
DMC3 is easily the best brawler I've ever played.
03:46
< Shoukanjuu>
I lack Sony anything
03:46
<@McMartin>
And one of the games they made harder for the NA release.
03:46
< Shoukanjuu>
I'm going to buy an dchip a PS2
03:46
< Shoukanjuu>
>_>
03:46
<@McMartin>
DMC3SE, for serious.
03:46
< Shoukanjuu>
One of the ONLY games they made harder for the NA release.
03:46
< Shoukanjuu>
Ever.
03:46
<@McMartin>
Einh?nder
03:46
<@McMartin>
Get Over FF2.
03:47
<@McMartin>
Espeically since FF2 got its full release already as FFIV.
03:47
< Shoukanjuu>
So then we have what, two games released in multiple regions that were made harder for NA instead of easier.
03:47
< Shoukanjuu>
Alternatively, not changed at all, save for localization
03:47
<@McMartin>
Not changed at all is the default.
03:47
< Shoukanjuu>
Right.
03:47
<@McMartin>
And, indeed, the Way To Do It.
03:48
<@McMartin>
Which is why you want DMC3SE, which has all the difficulty levels.
03:48
< Shoukanjuu>
Iif there's going to be difficulty changes
03:48
< Shoukanjuu>
You WANT all the difficulty levels
03:48
< Shoukanjuu>
What you don't want is peopel Not Knowing What They're Getting Into.
03:48
< Shoukanjuu>
people*
03:48
<@McMartin>
I will give a pass for rebalancing on export
03:48
< Shoukanjuu>
As will I.
03:48
<@McMartin>
Like, if there were 40 versions of Street Fighter II and only 17 of them made it to NA, BFD.
03:49
<@McMartin>
... and you know, I'm not at all sure I made those numbers big enough
03:49
< Shoukanjuu>
XD
03:50
< Shoukanjuu>
Please don't use acronyms that aren't obvious to people who don't use acronyms for everything. ^^;
03:50
< Shoukanjuu>
It took me seconds to think BFD meant 'big fucking deal'
03:50
<@McMartin>
You're a young'in!
03:50
<@McMartin>
BFD is older than the internets!
03:50
< Shoukanjuu>
YOU CAN'T BE MORE THAN FIVE YEARS OLDER THAN ME.
03:50
<@McMartin>
Well, that's reasonable, but it's not guaranteed.
03:50 * McMartin is in fact 30.
03:50
< Shoukanjuu>
Well, okay.
03:51
< Shoukanjuu>
You're older than ten years older than me.
03:51
<@McMartin>
BFE, however, was before my time.
03:51 * McMartin had to be taught that one by his parents.
03:51
<@McMartin>
"Buttfuck, Egypt", the stereotypical place a long way away.
03:52
< Shoukanjuu>
...Well okay.
03:52
<@McMartin>
Oddly, I've heard people younger than me use "East Buttfuck" the same way, and I have no idea if I just missed out on slang or if this is something new.
03:53
< Shoukanjuu>
I have a rather unhealthy habit of cutting words in half and inserting "the fuck" betwixt the broken pieces. >_>
03:53
< Shoukanjuu>
Or perhaps two word phrases.
03:54
< Shoukanjuu>
"come on" and "whatever" being among the most common.
03:54
< Shoukanjuu>
I don't remember hearing whatthefuckever anywhere.
03:55
< Shoukanjuu>
And it couldn't possibly be from the internet, because when I started using it about five years ago, I had dial up that was always unable to connect because we had one phone line and my mother never got a damn job
03:55
<@McMartin>
Hm. whatfuckingever is pretty common.
03:55
<@McMartin>
Though not as common as fanfuckingtastic or fan-tucking-fastic.
03:56
< Shoukanjuu>
Oh, no, it's definitely "what-the-fuck-ever"
03:56
< Shoukanjuu>
It might be an altered "what the fuck" and "whatever"
03:56
<@Consul>
I remember the first time my dad caught me saying the word "fuck."
03:56
< Shoukanjuu>
From using both 500 times with the "high school student" title equipped
03:57
<@Consul>
I was in my bedroom, and I yelled at my dad, "close the door, I'm trying to fuck in here!"
03:57
< Shoukanjuu>
First time my dad caught me using the word he told me to use it right the next time
03:57
< Shoukanjuu>
My mom tanned my hide and sent me to bed without lunch or dinner XD
03:58
< Shoukanjuu>
Though, to this day, I think it's because she used food stamps on cigarettes instead of food, so she did it on purpose to make it seem like there was food to be had.
03:59
< Shoukanjuu>
Needless to say, I'm glad I got out of there before there was too much lasting damage. *nodnod*
03:59
<@Consul>
Heh
03:59
< Shoukanjuu>
So uh.
03:59
< Shoukanjuu>
Wesker in RE5.
03:59
<@Consul>
I just told a dumb joke, and here you are, soul-searching. :-P
04:00
< Shoukanjuu>
There's not much of my soul to search! I sold it for food and golds.
04:02
< Shoukanjuu>
There were never enough golds.
04:02
< Shoukanjuu>
Never enough.
04:03
<@ToxicFrog>
McMartin: what's this about exploiting the metagame in DMC1?
04:03
<@McMartin>
TF: Aborting a level repeatedly halfway through to farm orbs.
04:04
<@ToxicFrog>
Aah.
04:04
<@ToxicFrog>
I did that once - the hallway encounter with Giant Magma Spider
04:04
<@McMartin>
DMC3 makes it clear that level replays are allowed, expected, desirable
04:04
<@ToxicFrog>
huge orbs/time payoff
04:04
<@McMartin>
Aye
04:04
<@McMartin>
However, if you come up short, you can't just go back and do it more without replaying the entire game.
04:04
<@ToxicFrog>
DMC3 is also much, much harder ;.;
04:05 * McMartin never did beat the level with the hallway encounter with the GIant Magma Spider. He's beaten DMC3 on NA Hard.
04:05
< Shoukanjuu>
Why are you crying?
04:05
< Shoukanjuu>
WHY ARE YOU CRYING ABOUT IT BEING HARDER?
04:06
<@ToxicFrog>
Shoukanjuu: because DMC1 was already fairly hard and I would like to be able to beat the game without rampantly cheating?
04:06
< Shoukanjuu>
But...
04:06
< Shoukanjuu>
Well, I assume you don't buy games because they're hard, do you?
04:06
<@ToxicFrog>
Re: resident evil: 4 got it right, IMO. Over the shoulder camera, reloading as a free action in the inventory screen and upgradeable outside it, no camera dickery.
04:06
< Shoukanjuu>
Not everyone's like me, heh.
04:07
<@ToxicFrog>
Shoukanjuu: if it's sufficiently hard that I derive no enjoyment and only frustration from it, then no, I won't buy it.
04:07
<@ToxicFrog>
See: most SHMUPs.
04:07
<@ToxicFrog>
As it happens I did buy DMC3, because despite it constantly kicking my ass I do, in fact, enjoy playing it
04:07
< Shoukanjuu>
I had fun spending a year in a half trying to 1cc and then no death beat Ikaruga in hard mode.
04:07
<@ToxicFrog>
But I would like to be able to see the ending cutscene someday.
04:07
< Shoukanjuu>
Best forty dollars I have ever spent that didn't pay me back monetarily.
04:08
< Shoukanjuu>
XD
04:08
<@ToxicFrog>
Having played Ikaruga, I can see how it would be a lot of fun for someone who isn't me~
04:09
< Shoukanjuu>
I enjoyed Ninja Gaiden II, the NES one, more than the first and third...But damned if I didn't beat them
04:09
< Shoukanjuu>
And Ninja Gaiden and NG 2 for the Xbox and 360 respectively...
04:10
< Shoukanjuu>
Well, I still can't quite beat Master Ninja without dying, or Path of the Mentor in 2
04:10
< Shoukanjuu>
Ninja Gaiden was decent about it, NG2 was just......:(
04:11
<@ToxicFrog>
I've played NG1NES, but it didn't do much for me. Never tried the 3d ones.
04:11
<@McMartin>
I refuse to play the NES NGs without savestates.
04:11
<@ToxicFrog>
I do have Shinobi for PS2, which is entertaining yet brutal.
04:11
<@McMartin>
Since the NES NGs actually remove continue points as you advance.
04:12
<@McMartin>
As in, getting further then dying will throw up back four entire levels.
04:12
<@McMartin>
Fuck you, Tecmo. I decide which bits I'll be practicing.
04:13
< Shoukanjuu>
:P
04:13
<@ToxicFrog>
Kitten hearts, etc
04:16
< Shoukanjuu>
I don't think I'm ever going to S rank this mission.
04:17
< Shoukanjuu>
For some reason, I decided to, instead of Doing it Right and using anything but the handgun
04:17
< Shoukanjuu>
Use the handgun to kill the boss of this chapter v_v
04:19
<@McMartin>
TF: No, this is kitten heart transplants.
04:19
<@McMartin>
As in, if you die on level 6.3, you'll start at the end or the middle of 6.3 somewhere.
04:19
< Shoukanjuu>
XD
04:19
<@McMartin>
Die on 6.4, and you respawn at the beginning of 6.1
04:19
< Shoukanjuu>
\o/
04:20
<@McMartin>
I have no idea what the fuck they were thinking.
04:20
< Shoukanjuu>
Why doesn't everyone like Wesker? :(
04:26
<@ToxicFrog>
Because he's a dick, and he's come back from the dead so many times now it's even more ridiculous than most of the RE canon, which is well past B-movie territory to begin with.
04:28
< Shoukanjuu>
That's what makes him so awesome XD
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06:36
< Shoukanjuu>
I just realized I could switch to knife while reloading in Umbrella Chronicles
06:36
< Shoukanjuu>
Slash once
06:37
< Shoukanjuu>
And have the reload *finished*
06:37
< Shoukanjuu>
Even for things that take considerably longer o_O
06:37
<@McMartin>
zomghax!
06:37
<@McMartin>
I bet that would make it way less obnoxious
06:38
< Shoukanjuu>
Wait, no, but it DOES continue whiel you're knifing, it seems.
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21:30
< Consul>
This is odd...
21:30
< Consul>
For some reason, my on-board sound is getting monopolized by whatever app grabs the driver first.
21:31
< Consul>
That never happened before...
21:32
<@McMartin>
Pulseaudio wackiness?
21:32
< Consul>
It's a fresh install of Ubuntu Hardy 32-bit
21:33
< Consul>
I can't get the rt kernel working either. It can't load up any of the modules installed.
21:34
< Consul>
Yeah, this is completely broken.
21:35
<@McMartin>
Ubuntu uses Pulseaudio, whic has at least for now set Linux sound back several years
21:35
<@McMartin>
It promises to solve the massive failures of OSS and ALSA and esd and arts though
21:36
< Consul>
Well, it has ALSA and PulseAudio on it. ALSA is not a sound server, it's a sound card driver system, right?
21:36
< Consul>
I had none of these problems running 64-bit Ubuntu on this exact system.
21:37
<@McMartin>
ALSA and OSS are not servers but they can be accessed directly by applications
21:37
<@McMartin>
If they do so, they will monopolize it.
21:37
< Consul>
So, the question then, is why isn't PulseAudio doing its job?
21:38
< Consul>
I set the entire system to use it...
21:39
< Consul>
I'm doing nothing different now than on my 64-bit load.
21:39
< Consul>
Same programs, same repositories.
21:40
< Consul>
And not only can I not get the rt kernel working, I can't get sound working right either.
21:40
< Consul>
Welcome to fucking Linux, I guess.
21:41
< Consul>
Maybe it's time to try Fedora again.
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21:42
<@McMartin>
FWIW, I don't know about Ubuntu sound directly; my Ubuntu machine has no speakers
21:42
< Consul>
Has package management on Fedora improved beyond "download an RPM, get told you're missing dependencies, and it's up to you to figure out what you need in a chain going 8 back" approach they took before?
21:42
<@McMartin>
Uh, very yes.
21:42
<@McMartin>
You haven't used Yum directly since Fedora 1, AFAIK.
21:42
<@McMartin>
Er, RPM directly
21:43
<@McMartin>
Instead you use yum, which does all transitive checks.
21:43
< Consul>
Fedora 3 was like that.
21:43
< Consul>
It also had massive memory leaks, and I had to reboot it once an hour.
21:43
<@McMartin>
... OK, that wasn't my experience with it.
21:43
< Shoukanjuu>
frustrating level is frustrating
21:43
<@McMartin>
I used it as my core development/operation platform on a laptop through its entire lifespan, plus FC4's.
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21:44
<@McMartin>
The only thing I ever consistently had trouble with on it was ACPI.
21:44
<@McMartin>
If other people are making shitty RPMs, that may still be a problem.
21:44
<@McMartin>
But yum's core repositories about a thousand times saner than Debian's.
21:44
<@McMartin>
You will, however, need to register the Livna repository.
21:45
<@McMartin>
(Which is where the nonfree stuff lives)
21:45
< Consul>
How up-to-date do they keep the software?
21:45
<@McMartin>
Better than Debian, worse than tracking the sources yourself.
21:45
<@McMartin>
Their goal is a smaller core set of apps that are focused on.
21:46
< Consul>
I can live with better than Debian. I usually compile myself apps I want really up to date.
21:46
<@McMartin>
Instead of a sprawling wasteland that nevertheless has everything.
21:46
< Consul>
Now the question is, 32 or 64 bit. You've said Fedora gets the mixed system better than any other...
21:46
<@McMartin>
It does. However, Yum does trip up a bit more on 64-bit systems.
21:46
< Consul>
I'll stick to 32 for now, then.
21:47
<@McMartin>
You'll get a thousand conflict errors on an update, and it will be because it installed both the 64- and 32-bit binaries at once by mistake
21:47
<@McMartin>
So you occasionally have to track down and yum erase a .i386 version of something
21:47
<@McMartin>
However, the libs are dual-installed and live in harmony
21:48
< Consul>
Well, once concern is, I see i386, and X86-64, but not i686, which would be nice.
21:48
< Consul>
It's either the lowest common denominator or the bleeding edge...
21:48
<@McMartin>
I'm pretty sure i386 includes i686 code.
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21:48
< Consul>
They differentiate between the two in their live CDs
21:49
<@McMartin>
If nothing else, I know for a fact that uqm-0.6.2.i386 includes MMX and SSE and 3DNow!.
21:49
< Consul>
I'm grabbing the i386 one now.
21:50
< Consul>
It'll be done in about 7 hours. :-/
21:50
< Consul>
Another reason I liked Ubuntu: It's a CD
21:50
< Consul>
Or can I get say, just disc 1 of the CD set and then use yum for whatever else?
21:51
<@McMartin>
I actually don't know
21:51
<@McMartin>
But I think you can install off the LiveCD.
21:52
< Consul>
Eh, I'll live with it. My system is good enough for watching Youtube vids, which will keep me occupied for seven hours.
21:53
< Consul>
Well, 6 and 1/4 hours, give or take.
21:53
< Consul>
I'm using a download manager, too. I learned that lesson the hard way.
21:54
< Consul>
The good news is, my /home is now on its own partition.
21:54
< Consul>
Now I can rotate around many partitions so much easier and try things out.
22:00
< Consul>
I wonder if "distro hopping" is the recognized term for what I'm doing.
22:02
<@McMartin>
Heh
22:03 * McMartin uses virtual machines for this purpose
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22:27 * gnolam managed to get his lab assistant to believe in trolls today.
22:27
<@gnolam>
Yay for race conditions.
22:29
<@AnnoDomini>
Do not feed the trolls.
22:33
<@gnolam>
We finally got it working, even if the solution itself was plain /wrong/ (but so was the problem).
22:34
<@gnolam>
When I enquired how I should proceed, his response was "DON'T TOUCH IT - it's /working/ now!"
22:34
<@gnolam>
So I got to hand in a working but incorrect solution, heh.
22:49
< Vornicus>
...no quack?
22:55 * Serah quacks Vorn.
22:56 * Vornicus ...quacks at Serah.
22:57
<@AnnoDomini>
The pig go. Go is to the fountain. The pig put foot. Grunt. Foot in what? Ketchup. The dove fly. Fly is in sky. The dove drop something. The something on the pig. The pig disgusting. The pig rattle. Rattle with dove. The dove angry. The pig leave. The dove produce. Produce is chicken wing. With wing bark. No Quack.
23:07
<@gnolam>
What.
23:07
<@AnnoDomini>
The origin of "<Vornicus> ...no quack?", I believe.
23:08
<@AnnoDomini>
Genetic algorithms were used to generate these sentences.
23:08
<@AnnoDomini>
Or something.
23:08
<@AnnoDomini>
You could google it up if you want to know more.
23:15
< Consul>
22% finished on that download. The speed keeps fluctuating. *sigh*
23:25
< Shoukanjuu>
Daaaammit. I don't think it's possible to get constant critical hits sitting this close to the sensor bar..... maybe if I mount it on the far wall... :/
23:32
< Vornicus>
Neural networks, and that was a mischan, but I can't find the right channel.
23:34
< Shoukanjuu>
Neural network, that's it! If I could somehow synchronize the Wii's controls with my mental faculties, I could *always* get critical hits.
23:34
<@AnnoDomini>
Be your own aimbot?
23:34
< Shoukanjuu>
Exactly!
23:38
< Shoukanjuu>
I was trying to think of a Star Trek-esque simplified analogy for the BS I just said
23:41
<@GeekSoldier>
Reverse the polarity, Shou.
23:42
< Shoukanjuu>
That would cause the energy to overflow into the AMS!
23:42
< Shoukanjuu>
I'd die.
23:46
< Shoukanjuu>
You guys don't know what I mean by AMS, do you?
23:48 Attilla [~The.Attil@Nightstar-9469.cdif.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Ping Timeout]
23:55 You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2]
23:59 You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ]
--- Log closed Sat Oct 11 00:00:49 2008
code logs -> 2008 -> Fri, 10 Oct 2008< code.20081009.log - code.20081011.log >