| --- Log opened Tue Dec 12 00:00:03 2006 |
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| 00:54 | < MyCatOwnz> | Hmmmm. What's the IPC on a MIPS chip like, I wonder? |
| 00:55 | < MyCatOwnz> | Someone put up a 16-way 250MHz MIPS box on eBay. I'm curious as to what that'll get through in practice. =) |
| 01:04 | | Janus [~Cerulean@Nightstar-10302.columbus.res.rr.com] has joined #Code |
| 01:32 | | * ToxicFrog gnargs |
| 01:32 | <@ToxicFrog> | I'm trying to build VBA, but the idiot who wrote it likes to cast pointers to uint32_t rather than to size_t or to ptrdiff_t. |
| 01:32 | <@ToxicFrog> | And I'm trying to build it for x86_64. |
| 01:33 | <@Vornicus> | what's VBA in this context? |
| 01:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | VisualBoyAdvance, a GBA emulator. |
| 01:34 | <@Vornicus> | ah, yes |
| 01:34 | <@Vornicus> | VBA is notoriously odd. |
| 01:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | There are binaries, but they're linked against the 32-bit version of libSDL, and thus DFW on 64-bit. |
| 01:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yeah. The windows version is ok except that I have three versions, one for each game I play routinely, because they have odd performance variations. |
| 01:41 | <@Vornicus> | the Mac one only works in fullscreen if you pick 2x size, has somewhat sticky modifier keys (which is bad when you find yourself trying to fire a missile in Fusion and end up pressing the Defrost key instead), seems to hang at particularly eventful moments (literally, the moment the boss would appear on the screen is the most common time for it to hang), and tends not to register if you hit keys too fast. |
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| 01:44 | <@ToxicFrog> | The windows one doesn't have "fullscreen" per se, but if you maximize the window it'll scale the image to match. |
| 01:45 | <@ToxicFrog> | But it doesn't have any such control issues. |
| 01:47 | <@ToxicFrog> | Anyways. Its configure script is kind of odd ("Checking for X11...no"), but the fact that the programmer is using uint32_ts to store pointers kind of overshadows that by having it fail to compile. |
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| 01:51 | | * Vornicus wants to write an emulator one day. |
| 01:53 | | * Vornicus also wants to build a chip one day. |
| 01:53 | <@Vornicus> | but for now, it is quitting time. |
| 01:53 | <@ToxicFrog> | A physical chip, or just an FPGA-mappable layout? |
| 01:53 | <@Vornicus> | And when I get home, I write some SQL views. |
| 01:54 | <@Vornicus> | well, an FPGA-mappable layout. Into an FPGA. |
| 01:54 | | Chalcedon [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 01:54 | <@Vornicus> | (or similar) |
| 01:54 | | * ToxicFrog nods |
| 01:54 | <@ToxicFrog> | I can recommend some good hardware and some truly awful software for this purpose~ |
| 01:54 | | * Vornicus wants something he can plug into something else and just use. |
| 01:54 | <@Vornicus> | Hometime. |
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| --- Log closed Tue Dec 12 02:29:08 2006 |
| --- Log opened Tue Dec 12 02:34:29 2006 |
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| 02:34 | | Irssi: #code: Total of 13 nicks [4 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 9 normal] |
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| 07:54 | < Vornicus> | <vorn> BEGINNINGS OF A DESCRIPTION OF A PROBLEM |
| 07:54 | < Vornicus> | <guru> ACCURATE ASSESSMENT OF REMAINDER OF PROBLEM |
| 07:54 | < Vornicus> | <vorn> AFFIRMATION |
| 07:54 | < Vornicus> | <guru> Interesting problem. |
| 07:55 | < Vornicus> | <vorn> crap. |
| 07:57 | < Ev3> | :p |
| 08:05 | < Reiver> | *snrk* |
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| 12:40 | < AnnoDomini> | Vornicus: Ehehehe. |
| --- Log closed Tue Dec 12 13:18:10 2006 |
| --- Log opened Tue Dec 12 13:18:15 2006 |
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| --- Log closed Tue Dec 12 13:32:02 2006 |
| --- Log opened Tue Dec 12 13:32:07 2006 |
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| 18:53 | <@Vornicus> | Hm. Bash: I want to place an environment variable, but I want to have characters that work as part of an env var name immediately after. |
| 18:54 | <@Vornicus> | How do I delimit the variable from the rest of the text? |
| 18:54 | <@ToxicFrog> | ${variable name} |
| 18:54 | <@Vornicus> | sweet |
| 18:54 | <@Vornicus> | thank you. |
| 18:55 | <@Vornicus> | ...oops, that variable has a / in it, I need to split it first. |
| 19:00 | <@ToxicFrog> | Playing with paths? |
| 19:00 | <@Vornicus> | yeah. |
| 19:01 | <@Vornicus> | I've got an environment variable with a filename in it, and I need to copy the file elsewhere... but I also need to /name/ the file, and I need the actual filename for that job, not the path to the fi... |
| 19:02 | <@Vornicus> | hey, that might work. |
| 19:02 | <@ToxicFrog> | Hang on, there's this cool thing you can do with bash |
| 19:02 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[afk] |
| 19:02 | <@Vornicus> | ...okay, ls doesn't do the job. |
| 19:03 | <@ToxicFrog> | ${varname##*/} |
| 19:03 | <@ToxicFrog> | Returns everything in var following the last / |
| 19:03 | <@Vornicus> | ...okay how |
| 19:03 | <@Vornicus> | /sweet/ |
| 19:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | Bash has all kinds of stuff like this. |
| 19:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | Greedy/nongreedy leading/trailing substrings, find-replace... |
| 19:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | http://tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/refcards.html -- check table B-5 |
| 19:05 | <@Vornicus> | ...bitchin and fly. |
| 19:05 | <@Vornicus> | I mean, thoroughly. |
| 19:05 | <@ToxicFrog> | In particular this means that basename, pathname, extension, basename without extension, etc are all single variable expansions. |
| 19:05 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yeah. |
| 19:09 | | * Vornicus makes the CI script slightly more awesome. |
| 19:10 | < jerith> | There's also 'basename' that stips the path off its argument. If the second argument occurs at the end of the first, that is stripped as well. |
| 19:10 | < jerith> | bash-3.00$ basename foo/bar/baz.txt |
| 19:10 | < jerith> | baz.txt |
| 19:10 | < jerith> | bash-3.00$ basename foo/bar/baz.txt .txt |
| 19:10 | < jerith> | baz |
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| 19:20 | <@Vornicus> | basename is probably clearer, but |
| 19:21 | < jerith> | #, ##, % and %% are cooler. :-) |
| 19:21 | <@ToxicFrog> | I suspect that basename is actually implemented in terms of this. |
| 19:21 | <@Vornicus> | hee |
| 19:22 | | * Vornicus just doesn't feel like futzing with it any more. |
| 19:22 | < jerith> | Possibly. |
| 19:23 | < jerith> | Question: who designed RJ45 and where do I go to cut him int very small pieces? |
| 19:23 | < jerith> | *into |
| 19:23 | <@ToxicFrog> | Blasphemy! |
| 19:24 | < jerith> | This is one of the flimsiest connectors I have ever used. |
| 19:24 | < jerith> | That littel clip thingy is the only thing that keeps the pug in the socket. |
| 19:25 | < jerith> | And that either doesn't catch or it breaks off. |
| 19:25 | < jerith> | *plug |
| 19:25 | <@Vornicus> | RJ45 is designed after (US, at least) phone cords. |
| 19:26 | < jerith> | Phone cords are usually RJ11. |
| 19:26 | < jerith> | And for a phone that's fine. You're not plugging them in and out all the time. |
| 19:26 | < jerith> | For a laptop it sucks. |
| 19:27 | <@Vornicus> | Idunno - I think that kind is better than friction plugs. |
| 19:27 | < jerith> | And no, wireless doesn't work for me. For a variety of reasons. |
| 19:27 | < jerith> | Vornicus: It's a great idea, but the implementation seriously sucks. |
| 19:27 | < jerith> | I saw an awsome audio cable connector a while back. |
| 19:27 | <@ToxicFrog> | Or perhaps you just have a poorly made connector and/or network cable. |
| 19:28 | <@ToxicFrog> | Err, network card. |
| 19:28 | < jerith> | Unplugging involved pulling a little catch and twisting the plug about 15 degrees. |
| 19:28 | <@Vornicus> | Professional audio connectors are /great/ |
| 19:28 | <@Vornicus> | Push, twist. |
| 19:29 | < jerith> | TF: I have this problem frequently, with many different cables and sockets. |
| 19:29 | < jerith> | The thing is, RJ45 is incredibly cheap to make. Who cares if it sucks? |
| 19:29 | <@Vornicus> | then then it stays /damn/ put. |
| 19:29 | < jerith> | Not the equipment manufacturers. |
| 19:30 | < jerith> | Why the hell can't we get something like that for ethernet kit? |
| 19:31 | <@Vornicus> | idunno |
| 19:31 | < jerith> | Of course, RJ45 is now impossible to dislodge from the market. |
| 19:32 | < jerith> | Aww, Kaz isn't here. |
| 19:32 | < jerith> | I wanted to ask what industrial networks used. |
| 19:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | jerith: actually, we did. |
| 19:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | Back with 10-base-2. |
| 19:34 | < jerith> | BNC? |
| 19:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yep. |
| 19:34 | < jerith> | BNC ws better, but it's only one pair. |
| 19:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | However, Cat5 has more than two wires, which makes that kind of rotary locking connector an absolute bastard to make. |
| 19:34 | < jerith> | *was |
| 19:35 | < jerith> | Also, BNC has shocking connector attenuation. |
| 19:36 | <@ToxicFrog> | I noet that the audio connectors Vorn speaks of are also single-pair. |
| 19:36 | < jerith> | Which doesn't matter for ethernet, but does for most applications of coax cable.. |
| 19:36 | <@ToxicFrog> | What you seem to want is something with the electrical properties of cat5 and the physical properties of BNC, which is non-trivial. |
| 19:36 | < jerith> | The one I saw was 3 wire. |
| 19:36 | | * Vornicus used to have a military-grade 70-ish pin wire on his desk. |
| 19:37 | < jerith> | Essentially the outer casing was free to rotate the 15 or so degrees required. |
| 19:37 | < Thaqui> | I don't know what industrial networks use, but in some telcos: Solder :) |
| 19:37 | <@ToxicFrog> | And since it's non-trivial, this means that it's expensive, at least relative to RJ-45 connectors. |
| 19:37 | <@Vornicus> | Thaq: /ouch/ |
| 19:37 | < Thaqui> | It does give the best connection. |
| 19:38 | < jerith> | Even simpler, a round multicore plug with a loose threaded ring. |
| 19:38 | | * Vornicus still wonders why usb to printer-usb is so damn expensive |
| 19:39 | <@Vornicus> | I mean, really. Six feet of wire. |
| 19:39 | < jerith> | Vornicus: Because that's what they can charge for it. |
| 19:40 | <@Vornicus> | I can do the same ten times in the space of 20 minutes from raw materials of the same price! |
| 19:40 | <@Vornicus> | well, not raw, but close enough |
| 19:40 | <@TheWatcher[afk]> | Vornicus: yes, but you aren't J Random Mugoffthestreet |
| 19:41 | <@Vornicus> | No, I'm not. |
| 19:41 | <@ToxicFrog> | Neither are the companies making and selling these cables at 900% markup. |
| 19:42 | <@TheWatcher[afk]> | They can't and the majority have no concept of the effort or cost involved, so fleecing them is simple. |
| 19:43 | < jerith> | Where does the J in J Random Foo come from? |
| 19:45 | | mode/#code [+o jerith] by jerith |
| 19:45 | <@Vornicus> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Random <--- suggests that it may be from "J Fred Muggs", a celebrity chimpanzee in the 50s. |
| 19:45 | <@jerith> | Yay for the random abuse of operness! |
| 19:45 | <@Vornicus> | Yes indeed. |
| 19:45 | | * jerith decides against /killing everyone. |
| 19:46 | <@Vornicus> | PLease don't do that. |
| 19:46 | <@jerith> | Hence the "decides against". |
| 19:46 | <@Vornicus> | :P |
| 19:46 | | * Vornicus reads about Ruby on Rails. |
| 19:47 | <@jerith> | I'd never *really* abuse my operness. |
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| 22:04 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 22:06 | <@Vornicus> | Troika had an owie, I see. |
| 22:07 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
| 22:08 | < AnnoDomini> | Yeah. |
| 22:08 | | * AnnoDomini uses Troika because of the fast connect times... |
| 22:08 | < MyCatOwnz> | Odd thought. |
| 22:09 | < MyCatOwnz> | What's the oldest X11 window manager, I wonder? |
| 22:10 | | Raif_ [~corvusign@Nightstar-16707.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #Code |
| 22:11 | | Netsplit DeepThought.NY.US.Nightstar.Net <-> Troika.TX.US.Nightstar.Net quits: @Pi, Raif_, @Raif, Vornicus-Latens, Ev3, AnnoDomini, @jerith, @Chalain |
| 22:11 | | * Vornicus reads about x11. |
| 22:11 | | Netsplit over, joins: Chalain, jerith, AnnoDomini, Raif, Ev3, Pi |
| 22:11 | | mode/#code [+o Chalain] by ChanServ |
| 22:11 | | Netsplit over, joins: Vornicus-Latens |
| 22:11 | | mode/#code [+o jerith] by ChanServ |
| 22:11 | | mode/#code [+o Raif] by ChanServ |
| 22:11 | | Netsplit over, joins: Raif_ |
| 22:11 | | mode/#code [+o Pi] by ChanServ |
| 22:11 | <@Vornicus> | CDE, perhaps? |
| 22:11 | <@Vornicus> | Motif appears to have been the first toolkit. |
| 22:12 | <@Vornicus> | ...well, okay, Motif is sorta a window manager. |
| 22:13 | | Raif [~corvusign@Nightstar-16707.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 22:13 | <@Vornicus> | motif or CDE, apparently |
| 22:13 | < MyCatOwnz> | I was thinking older. |
| 22:13 | < MyCatOwnz> | As in, the _very_ first. |
| 22:14 | <@Vornicus> | X11 is not /that/ old. |
| 22:14 | < MyCatOwnz> | It's older than me, comrade. |
| 22:14 | < MyCatOwnz> | Y'know how the standard line for breaking up flamewards between emacs users and vi users is, "ed is the standard editor?" |
| 22:16 | <@Vornicus> | X11 was released in 1987. |
| 22:17 | < MyCatOwnz> | X11 was first released on Sep. 15th 1987. |
| 22:17 | < MyCatOwnz> | I was first released on Oct. 24th 1987. |
| 22:17 | <@Vornicus> | wow |
| 22:17 | <@Vornicus> | You're younger than I thought |
| 22:18 | <@Vornicus> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uwm <--- perhaps it is the Ultrix Window Manager |
| 22:20 | <@Vornicus> | there seem to be mentions of two other window managers from that time, but I can't find information about their release dates or anythin. |
| 22:20 | <@Vornicus> | UWM seems to have come standard with X11. |
| 22:25 | <@Vornicus> | ...man, window managers have come simultaneously a long way and not that far at all. |
| 22:32 | | AnnoDomini [~fark.off@Nightstar-29728.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Some people find sanity a little confining.] |
| 22:40 | <@Vornicus> | ...whoa |
| 22:40 | <@Vornicus> | less has a lot of toys in it. |
| 22:58 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yeah. |
| 23:00 | | Chalcy [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #code |
| 23:00 | | mode/#code [+o Chalcy] by ChanServ |
| 23:01 | | Chalcedon [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 23:11 | | Chalcy is now known as Chalcedon |
| 23:29 | | MyCatOwnz is now known as MyCatBreaksHisComputer |
| 23:35 | | MyCatBreaksHisComputer [~mycatownz@Nightstar-379.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 23:47 | | MyCatOwnz [~mycatownz@Nightstar-379.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk] has joined #code |
| --- Log closed Wed Dec 13 00:00:03 2006 |