| --- Log opened Mon Aug 07 00:00:02 2006 |
| 01:31 | | Vornicus [~vorn@Admin.Nightstar.Net] has quit [Quit: ] |
| 02:40 | | Chalcy [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #code |
| 02:40 | | mode/#code [+o Chalcy] by ChanServ |
| 02:40 | | Chalcedon [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 04:04 | | Reiver is now known as ReivClass |
| 05:46 | | Chalc [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #code |
| 05:46 | | Chalc is now known as Chalcedon |
| 05:47 | | Chalcy [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 06:25 | | ReivClass is now known as Reiver |
| 06:27 | <@Reiver> | Er. What is an SVG file, and why would I want a mindmapper software to be able to export it? >.> |
| 06:29 | <@Mahal> | scalable vector graphics, Reivy |
| 06:29 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| 06:29 | <@Reiver> | Aha. |
| 06:30 | <@Reiver> | So in otherwords, so others without the software can probably see it. |
| 06:30 | | * Reiver gets it anyway, then. |
| 06:30 | <@Mahal> | Mindmap software??/ |
| 06:30 | | * Mahal curiouses!! |
| 06:31 | <@Reiver> | I thought I might try actually jotting down my vague design for the chess game I need to write. |
| 06:31 | <@Mahal> | Ah-hah. |
| 06:31 | <@Mahal> | Good idea. |
| 06:31 | <@Reiver> | Given it is to be an OO program, I thought being able to sketch out the various objects might, y'know, be useful. :) |
| 06:31 | | * Mahal nod |
| 06:31 | <@Reiver> | And mindmapping software lets you have bubbles with other bubbles linked, and and and... yes. |
| 06:32 | <@TheWatcher> | Reiver: you might want to look at UML |
| 06:32 | <@Reiver> | I was looking at Freemind, which I've used before. |
| 06:32 | <@Reiver> | However, I'm open for suggestions. |
| 06:32 | <@Reiver> | What's UML? |
| 06:33 | | * Mahal pokes at freemind |
| 06:34 | <@Mahal> | Unified modelling language, hon |
| 06:34 | <@TheWatcher> | Unified Modelling Language, it's a general-purpose modelling language with a standardised graphical representation notation |
| 06:34 | | * Mahal nodnod. |
| 06:34 | <@Mahal> | It is a Good Thing (TM) |
| 06:34 | <@TheWatcher> | Yeah, apparenty. Although I must admit I never use it ¬¬ |
| 06:37 | <@Mahal> | Me neither. |
| 06:37 | <@Mahal> | Doesn't stop it being good ;) |
| 06:38 | <@TheWatcher> | True ¬¬ |
| 06:43 | < Reivlin> | ...Ooookay. |
| 06:43 | < Reivlin> | So I'd use that instead of mind-mapping software? |
| 06:44 | < Reivlin> | Is it braindead to start using? |
| 06:44 | | Thokk is now known as EvilDarkLord |
| 06:44 | <@Mahal> | Reiver: I am not a programmer and I learned it wihtout ANY troubles. |
| 06:44 | < Reivlin> | Right. |
| 06:44 | < Reivlin> | UML. Hm. |
| 06:44 | <@Mahal> | (So, yes.) |
| 06:45 | < Reivlin> | Suggestions on a UML-making program in Linux? |
| 06:45 | < Reivlin> | (If it turns out to be vi/emacs I will cry.) |
| 06:45 | <@Mahal> | Heheh. |
| 06:45 | < EvilDarkLord> | The equivalent of Paint? |
| 06:46 | < Reivlin> | EDL: ...Whut. |
| 06:46 | | * Mahal pokes at Google. |
| 06:46 | <@TheWatcher> | Yeah, it's mostly a description of how to draw boxes with words in and connect them up. Also, try xfig |
| 06:46 | < Reivlin> | Ah. |
| 06:47 | <@Mahal> | http://uml.sourceforge.net/index.php |
| 06:47 | <@TheWatcher> | or, since you use kde, try Umbrello - http://uml.sourceforge.net/index.php |
| 06:47 | <@Mahal> | Umbrello |
| 06:47 | | * Mahal grin |
| 06:48 | <@Mahal> | Great minds, Watcher? |
| 06:48 | <@TheWatcher> | Quite :) |
| 06:48 | <@Mahal> | also http://argouml.tigris.org/ |
| 06:49 | < Reivlin> | Lesse if I can't do this with adept for a change... |
| 06:50 | <@Mahal> | adept? |
| 06:50 | < Reivlin> | ...Incidentally what sort of system overheads does Linux/Ubuntu inflict on you? |
| 06:50 | <@Mahal> | Sodall. |
| 06:50 | < Reivlin> | Package manager for Linux. |
| 06:50 | <@Mahal> | Oh. |
| 06:50 | | * Mahal only knows of apt-get and synaptic. |
| 06:50 | | * Reivlin is finding apt-get to be user-arguementive recently >.> |
| 06:50 | <@Mahal> | It mightn't be available that way. |
| 06:51 | <@TheWatcher> | "System overhead"s? |
| 06:51 | <@Mahal> | yeah. |
| 06:51 | < Reivlin> | TW: Should Kubuntu be running fast on a 1.6GHz P4 with 700MB of RAM? |
| 06:51 | <@Mahal> | As in, Windows *stuff* will eat say ~1/8 your system resources before you start running your own stuf. |
| 06:52 | < Reivlin> | And if so, why is it less responsive than Windows XP on the same boxen? >.> |
| 06:52 | <@TheWatcher> | Oh, I see. That's not linux as such, but down to the software you have running and which window manager you use. |
| 06:52 | | * Mahal chuckles |
| 06:52 | <@Mahal> | Yes. |
| 06:52 | < Reivlin> | Right, wel. |
| 06:52 | <@Mahal> | Reiver: |
| 06:52 | <@Mahal> | If you want to know the difference, open a console now and run top |
| 06:52 | | * Reivlin stab Xchat for horribly slowness in general then. |
| 06:53 | <@Mahal> | (and it's q to quit top) |
| 06:53 | <@Mahal> | Then, when you've saved all your doing at the moment, open a console, drop to level 3 (no graphic pretties) |
| 06:53 | <@Mahal> | then run top again |
| 06:53 | <@Mahal> | you'll see the differences. |
| 06:53 | <@Mahal> | X will be taking a lot of grunt. |
| 06:54 | <@TheWatcher> | Well, I'd say it's more likely to be KDE causing th eslowness than X itself. |
| 06:54 | <@Mahal> | Depends on the machine, but yes, on that one it will. |
| 06:54 | < Reivlin> | Does level 3 kill the GUI, or just the special effects? |
| 06:54 | < Reivlin> | >.> |
| 06:55 | <@Mahal> | Kills the gui entirely. |
| 06:55 | <@TheWatcher> | 3 kills the GUI |
| 06:55 | < Reivlin> | I'll... leave it for the moment then. :p |
| 06:55 | <@Mahal> | Yes, that's why I said "Whn you've done all your doing atm" :P |
| 06:55 | | * TheWatcher wonders if kubuntu comes with Enlightenment ¬¬ |
| 06:55 | | * Reivlin is scared of pure-console 'cuz he hasn't learned the magic buttons yet :p |
| 06:55 | <@Mahal> | Keystrokes you'll need for this: |
| 06:55 | <@Mahal> | 1) init 3 |
| 06:56 | <@Mahal> | that'll take you to runmode 3 |
| 06:56 | <@Mahal> | then when you've seen how much faster it goes using top |
| 06:56 | <@Mahal> | simply init 5 to get back to graphical pretties. |
| 06:56 | <@Mahal> | :) |
| 06:56 | < Reivlin> | ...Yes, but if there's no GUI there'll be /nothing running to be slow/ :p |
| 06:56 | <@Mahal> | Not that it's wildl important. |
| 06:57 | <@Mahal> | EXACTLY MY POINT, you knob :P |
| 06:57 | <@Mahal> | (And there will be plenty of other processes.) |
| 06:57 | <@Mahal> | (Trust me on this.) |
| 06:57 | | * Reivlin grumble. |
| 06:57 | | * TheWatcher snerks |
| 06:57 | <@TheWatcher> | Reivlin: .. that's a point, what graphics card does it have in there? |
| 06:57 | <@Mahal> | That's why there is more than one window manager available for unixen. |
| 06:57 | < Reivlin> | TW: Probably onboard... |
| 06:57 | <@Mahal> | some of them run WAAAAAY less resources. |
| 06:58 | < Reivlin> | Was an ex-buisness machine. |
| 06:58 | <@Mahal> | I forget what TL uses, but Colitis likes icewm |
| 06:58 | < Reivlin> | window manager? |
| 06:58 | <@Mahal> | Yes. |
| 06:58 | <@Mahal> | eg, gnome, kde, icewm... |
| 06:58 | < Reivlin> | Ah. |
| 06:59 | | * Reivlin went with kde as apparently it was a fairly friendly one. |
| 06:59 | <@TheWatcher> | X is th elow level graphics system, then on top of that you have a window manager that alows you to move windows around and provide menus and stuff, on top of that you have toolkits thta provide additional widget types and on top of thta you have the stuff desktops provide. |
| 06:59 | < Reivlin> | Right. |
| 06:59 | <@Mahal> | thanks Watcher. |
| 06:59 | <@Mahal> | I knew I didn't have it quite right. |
| 06:59 | <@Mahal> | I have horribly spotty general knoweldge |
| 07:00 | | * Reivlin ponders just coding in windows and starting to futz about with getting different flavors of Linux, as Kubuntu seems to be not all that useful in some ways... if nothing else, no-one other than Grue seems to use it :p |
| 07:00 | < Reivlin> | (Or KDE in general.) |
| 07:01 | <@Mahal> | uh - the window manager isn't the linux flavour. |
| 07:01 | <@Mahal> | :) |
| 07:01 | <@TheWatcher> | Gnome and KDE will, IIRC, let you change the window manager they use, but frankly I just tend to drop the desktop entirely and use a bare window manager - they often provide enough stuff to let you launch other processes without the extra clutter and resource use of all the extra buttons, bars and thingummyjigs |
| 07:02 | | * TheWatcher wonders if it's still online... |
| 07:02 | | * Mahal nods. |
| 07:02 | <@Reiver> | TW: I'd like to be able to do most things mouse-only. |
| 07:03 | | * Mahal wonders why? |
| 07:03 | <@Reiver> | Mahal: RSI from typing? |
| 07:03 | <@Mahal> | Not a criticism, just curiousity. |
| 07:03 | <@Mahal> | Ah. |
| 07:03 | <@Reiver> | And Mahal: I had been told one of the big downsides of the Ubuntu flavors is that changing the window manager is a right PITA. |
| 07:03 | <@Reiver> | This may be rumor and slander. But I'm not exactly an expert on such advice. |
| 07:03 | <@TheWatcher> | That I can believe, hene why they have the different flavours of ubuntu... |
| 07:04 | | * Mahal has no idea. |
| 07:04 | <@Reiver> | This is /why/ I have Opera, and Opera configured for mouse gestures/click shortcuts etc. |
| 07:04 | | * Mahal also notes she gave Reiver an Ubuntu disk as well as Kubuntu, as well as FC5 |
| 07:04 | <@Reiver> | So I can do web browsing without mouse at all. |
| 07:04 | <@Mahal> | (wihtout kbd) |
| 07:04 | | * Mahal ponders dinner. |
| 07:05 | <@TheWatcher> | Reiv: you can still use the mouse for most things without the desktop, you just don't have bars everywhere |
| 07:05 | <@Reiver> | And why even the littlest inconviniences in chat client interfaces will drive me nuts - augh Xchat needing you to rightclick /everything/ and stuff >.< |
| 07:05 | <@Reiver> | TW: Is there a way to see it without killing everything in the process? |
| 07:05 | <@TheWatcher> | ... huh, rightclick? |
| 07:06 | <@Reiver> | TW: I can't shift-click to close windows (Or to my knowledge, any other modified 'single click'). In mIRC, if you click a tab you go to it, but if you click the same tab again it will 'minimize' to the previously open tag. |
| 07:07 | <@Reiver> | Xchat requires you to actually move the mouse back to the previous tab, or again, rightclick, or use kb shortcuts. |
| 07:08 | | * Reiver has his computer largely set up to let a mouse do stuff in the absolute minimum of clicks and moves, and to be /either/ keyboard /or/ mouse - with the preference being on mouse-heavy. |
| 07:09 | <@TheWatcher> | Hmm |
| 07:09 | | * Reiver thus has large numbers of handy little menus and context menus and mouse gestures (Could I have an OS that has mouse gestures? Please?) and and and... yes. |
| 07:09 | <@Reiver> | (Xchat also has a few quirks in highlighting that drive me mad when I want the "Reiver" to be highlight, but /not/ "Reiver changes his nick to..." >.<) |
| 07:10 | <@TheWatcher> | And no, there probably isn't a way to see it without |
| 07:10 | <@Reiver> | (As for some arcane reason Xchat does not differentiate between the two types of text, or at least didn't in my first run-through of the menus.) |
| 07:10 | <@Reiver> | What linux do ye run, TW? |
| 07:10 | <@TheWatcher> | Oh, and IIRC Enlightenment, FVWM and Windowmaker (all three are window managers) will let you use mouse gestures. |
| 07:11 | <@TheWatcher> | Yes, ish |
| 07:11 | <@Reiver> | For some reason Kubuntu uses Konqueror for folders. |
| 07:11 | <@Reiver> | It is horrid. |
| 07:11 | <@Reiver> | It was even /more/ horrid when it was the default browser, but... >.< |
| 07:12 | <@TheWatcher> | I have ahalf a dozen boxes running it, but mostof the time I connect to them by exporting the display to an Cygwin X server on windows, unless I'm not using LW or anything else that needs windows. |
| 07:12 | <@TheWatcher> | s/an/a/ |
| 07:13 | <@Reiver> | "half a dozen boxes running it?" Ubuntu? |
| 07:13 | <@TheWatcher> | No, gentoo |
| 07:13 | <@Reiver> | Oh, right |
| 07:13 | | * Reiver hrms. |
| 07:13 | <@Reiver> | Okay, den. |
| 07:13 | <@Reiver> | Let's start a Religious War. |
| 07:14 | <@Reiver> | What would one suggest for a total linux-newb like m'self regarding Linux flavor, and GUI for it? |
| 07:14 | <@Reiver> | >.> |
| 07:14 | <@TheWatcher> | hmm |
| 07:15 | | * EvilDarkLord listens attentively too. |
| 07:17 | <@Reiver> | Is gentoo a good idea? Was (K)ubuntu? I've heard bad rap about Fedora and Redhat, although I don't entirely know what the problems are exactly. |
| 07:18 | < Reivlin> | 0 |
| 07:19 | <@TheWatcher> | Gentoo most certainly is not a good idea for a beginner. Hell,it's not even a goodidea for a moderate user - it works great most of the time, but if something goes wrong you need an intimate knowledge of th eguts of a system to fix it, and you're looking at spending a good day or more with nothing but a shell prompt. |
| 07:20 | <@TheWatcher> | Ubuntu is, apparently, better for a beginner. It might be worth trying ubuntu rather than kubuntu to see which works faster, or oyu might want to try Mandriva. |
| 07:21 | <@Reiver> | Hmm. Never heard of the latter. |
| 07:21 | <@Reiver> | But I guess if I went for Ubuntu, it'd make life easier on the basis that it's the one everyone seems to know... |
| 07:22 | <@TheWatcher> | But beyond that, I'm probably not th ebest person to ask - I've been using linux for the best part of 6 or 7 years now, and rarely evangelise, so I don't really kep up with the best distros for new users. |
| 07:22 | <@Reiver> | Is it possible to have more than one Linux install on a particular partition? |
| 07:23 | <@Reiver> | Is it possible to shift software you've installed via apt-get so that you can have the packages sitting on your HD for later installation? |
| 07:23 | <@TheWatcher> | Technically possibleto have multiple installs on one partition, probably. Realistically? |
| 07:24 | | * Mahal can only speak for her moderate-to-n00b experience: |
| 07:24 | <@Mahal> | I like gnome. |
| 07:24 | <@Mahal> | I also like Redhat, because a) I've used it b) all the work servers use variants of it |
| 07:24 | <@TheWatcher> | (IME gnome is smaller and faster than KDE, at the same time it isn't as polished) |
| 07:24 | <@Mahal> | Yes. |
| 07:24 | <@Mahal> | Polished doesn't bother me. |
| 07:24 | | * TheWatcher nods |
| 07:24 | <@Reiver> | I was quite liking KDE. But it is apparently... not as popular these days. |
| 07:24 | <@Reiver> | Aha, is /that/ it? |
| 07:25 | <@Mahal> | It does lack features. |
| 07:25 | | * Reiver had heard gnome get something of a bad rap for being... not as 'complete' as KDE. |
| 07:25 | <@Reiver> | Hrm. What features? |
| 07:25 | <@Mahal> | And one of my biggest personally annoyances was that gnome v2 removed the multiple desktop wallpaper thing. |
| 07:25 | <@Mahal> | I know it/s a small thing in general. |
| 07:25 | <@Mahal> | But omg it was annoying. |
| 07:25 | <@Reiver> | multiple desktop wallpaper thing. |
| 07:25 | <@Mahal> | You know what multiple dsktops are? |
| 07:26 | <@Mahal> | Older versins of gnome allowed you to have multiple walls on them. |
| 07:26 | <@Mahal> | This made it immensely easy for me to see where I was. |
| 07:26 | <@TheWatcher> | Linux window managers will usually let you have multiple desktops that you can swithc between, eahc one a seperate work area really. |
| 07:26 | <@Reiver> | ...Why would they /remove/ that? >.> |
| 07:27 | | * Mahal knows not. |
| 07:27 | <@TheWatcher> | Some will combine virtual desktops - desktops several times the size of the screen you're using - with multiple desktops to give you immense amounts of workspace. |
| 07:27 | <@Mahal> | Yes!!! |
| 07:27 | <@Mahal> | That was fantastic. |
| 07:27 | | * Reiver knows the multiple window thingy. Had personally found it largely useless as he always got lost which one was meant to be what and just ended up using everything on one desktop instead. >.< |
| 07:27 | <@Mahal> | Heh. |
| 07:27 | <@Mahal> | I tended to have several desktops, with my IM applications spanning all desktops. |
| 07:27 | <@Mahal> | It works for me. |
| 07:28 | | * TheWatcher notes that is one thing he misses when using windows, but does make up for it somewhat by having two monitors anyway |
| 07:28 | <@Mahal> | That was when I still had one monitor though. |
| 07:29 | <@Reiver> | Mahal: That's how I always /envisioned/ myself using it... |
| 07:29 | <@Reiver> | It just... never quite worked out the way I planned. >.> |
| 07:29 | | * Mahal actually >did< it |
| 07:30 | <@Reiver> | Mahal: I just get lost which window I'm meant to be on and give up. |
| 07:30 | <@TheWatcher> | (that's another thing I like about Englightenment - you get 'Pager's - little windows that give you a constantly updated small picture of the other desktops, and you can move the mouse over a window in a pager to get a zoomed view and click on it to go right there |
| 07:30 | <@TheWatcher> | ) |
| 07:30 | <@Mahal> | That's kinda nifty. |
| 07:30 | <@Reiver> | ...Okay, so. |
| 07:30 | <@Mahal> | Enlightenment? |
| 07:30 | <@Reiver> | "Enlightenment" is another GUI like Gnome or KDE? Or it is something that sits on top? |
| 07:32 | <@TheWatcher> | http://enlightenment.sourceforge.net/ - the DR16 stuff on there |
| 07:32 | <@TheWatcher> | It's a window manager with a feature list longer than your arm |
| 07:33 | <@Reiver> | Right, okay. |
| 07:34 | <@Reiver> | So... a window manager is a what, then? |
| 07:34 | <@Reiver> | Gnome/KDE, right? |
| 07:34 | <@Reiver> | Er. Better way to put it. |
| 07:34 | <@Reiver> | Gnome and KDE are window managers, yes/no? |
| 07:34 | <@TheWatcher> | No |
| 07:35 | <@TheWatcher> | Gnome and KDE are desktop environments. they're window manager + lots and lots of other junk |
| 07:35 | <@Reiver> | Ah-/hah/. |
| 07:36 | <@Reiver> | So if I were to take Enlightenment, I'd then need to figure out the 'lots and lots of other junk' m'self? :) |
| 07:37 | <@TheWatcher> | No, you don't need it - you launch programs through a menu that pops up when you left click th edesktop (or right click, or middle click to get at other menus) |
| 07:38 | <@Reiver> | Do you get a taskbar doodad? |
| 07:38 | <@Reiver> | (Forgive the stupid questions. >.>) |
| 07:39 | <@TheWatcher> | not as such, no. You can get a window list, which does a similar sort of job |
| 07:40 | | * Reiver tries to get his head around this. |
| 07:40 | | * Reiver decides to do a little wiki'ing. |
| 07:40 | <@TheWatcher> | I used to have a screenshot of it, but blegh, looks like I deleted it |
| 07:43 | <@Reiver> | What I'm mostly trying to figure out is: If you have a desktop enviroment, does that mean I effectively have the desired GUI, or do you literally just have a desktop without the taskbar/multiple desktop selector/program listing/menu bars/etc? |
| 07:43 | <@Reiver> | And if the latter, can you happily futz about anyway, and/or find your own bits? |
| 08:07 | | Reiver is now known as ReivF0d |
| 08:20 | | EvilDarkLord is now known as Thokk |
| 08:41 | | Thokk is now known as Thokk2001 |
| 09:07 | | * TheWatcher erks, didn't notice the question herein |
| 09:09 | <@TheWatcher> | The answer: depends! Some window managers provide more than others - generally the absolute minimum is some kind of menu from which you can launch programs, almost all window managers will provide controls for switching to alternative desktops (though I've yet to run into one that does Enlightenment's tricks), some will also provide a bar or list of windows in some form. |
| 09:11 | <@TheWatcher> | All (well, almost, probably) window managers provide less 'up front' than a desktop environment - they generally hide much of the functionality away behind menus or window-border control buttons rather than having it plonked right on top of you. |
| 09:41 | | You're now known as theWatcher[afk] |
| 10:39 | | ReivF0d is now known as Reiver |
| 11:09 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[afk] |
| 11:28 | | Mahal [~Mahal@Nightstar-5192.worldnet.co.nz] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] |
| 11:36 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[wr0k] |
| 12:29 | < Lukhan> | Kubunu is kinda bleh. not because of KDE but because of Ubuntu. Ubuntu has a lot of issues, imo. not least of which is they make it REALLY HARD to make it support hardware they haven't bothered to make their own versions of the drivers for. you can't, for instance, just use the OFFICIAL LINUX DRIVERS for your hardware because they don't let you have the kernel source to compile against... |
| 12:30 | < Lukhan> | also I love gentoo. :P |
| 12:30 | <@Reiver> | Luk: I'm a newb, and I need to be able to function semi-indipendantly. |
| 12:31 | < Lukhan> | also, TheWatcher is wrong when he says gentoo is bad for a beginner. Simply because it's even HARDER to fix anything like ubuntu when it goes wrong, because they refuse to give you the tools you need. at least with gentoo you can find someone who knows what they're doing to help you. ubuntu you're just fucked anally with no lube. |
| 12:31 | <@Reiver> | I want a GUI I can get the hang of whilst I poke around learning the voodoo. |
| 12:32 | <@Reiver> | I am not /terribly/ concerned what it is running on top of, although I am somewhat suspicious of Redhat, and less so but still regarding Fedora. |
| 12:32 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | That's the problem for Reiv - /none/ of the sysadmin stuff for gentoo has a gui, unless you dig around looking for something to wrap it. |
| 12:32 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | You're just editing text files and hammering the command line |
| 12:32 | < Lukhan> | there is that. otoh, gentoo has very very very good docs. |
| 12:33 | < Lukhan> | if you want to learn linux, I'd have to say gentoo is way better than ubuntu. ubuntu gives up all the things that make linux /linux/ and you're just left with a somewhat-more-stable windows that doesn't have any games. :p |
| 12:34 | < Lukhan> | and the files are actually really easy to get a handle on, too. at least imo. |
| 12:34 | < Lukhan> | and honestly, I've never had any problems at all with KDE. |
| 12:35 | < Lukhan> | started with Gnome. when I switched to KDE (I forget why now, hmm), I instantly fell in love and will never go back :p |
| 12:37 | <@Reiver> | Lukhan: This leads to a conflict of interest. |
| 12:37 | <@Reiver> | As I have a list of things I need to do. |
| 12:37 | < Lukhan> | What are these things? ;P |
| 12:38 | <@Reiver> | My highest priority is learning to code Java. |
| 12:38 | < Lukhan> | I'm sorry. |
| 12:38 | <@Reiver> | I wish to do this on Linux. |
| 12:38 | <@Reiver> | (I know. Course requirement. Woe.) |
| 12:38 | <@Reiver> | So my first priority regarding Linux is learning to use Linux. |
| 12:38 | <@Reiver> | Learning Linux itself is a secondary priority, and generally hoped to be pick-it-up-as-I-go deal. |
| 12:39 | <@Reiver> | The difference between futzing about in Word on windows and it's control panels, and digging through your registry files, so to speak. :p |
| 12:39 | < Lukhan> | I'm finding it that way with gentoo. :p I've been using it for ... hmm. maybe nine months now? I was using ubuntu for a few months before I had some serious troubles. |
| 12:40 | < Lukhan> | and emerge is a beautiful thing for making stuff work. |
| 12:40 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | This is true. |
| 12:40 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | Usually, anyway. |
| 12:40 | < Lukhan> | well ... yes. |
| 12:41 | < Lukhan> | but I've found emerge to be significantly more reliable than apt-get. |
| 12:46 | <@Reiver> | emerge? |
| 12:48 | < Lukhan> | the gentoo package manager. |
| 12:48 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | the entire package system is called Portage while the program that does the magic is emerge |
| 12:51 | < Lukhan> | http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/index.xml <-- their docs, if you care to browse :P |
| 13:08 | | Thokk2001 is now known as EvilDarkLord |
| 14:00 | | EvilDarkLord is now known as EvilNromingLord |
| 14:08 | <@ToxicFrog> | Reiver: personally, my recommendation if you just want to whack it down and use it without worrying about the internals is Fedora. |
| 14:09 | <@ToxicFrog> | Reserve two / partitions and you can easily install Gentoo (or Debian or Slackware or $other_distro_of_choice) to mess about with the guts later. |
| 14:10 | <@Reiver> | Fedora? Really? |
| 14:11 | | * Reiver had heard less than stellar opinions of it, in the past? |
| 14:11 | | * ToxicFrog has been using it for years with no issues, and indeed considerably fewer issues than Debian or Gentoo. I confess I haven't tried Ubuntu, though. |
| 14:12 | <@ToxicFrog> | Both as a desktop (well, a laptop) and as a server. |
| 14:13 | <@ToxicFrog> | If I have one major complaint, it's that the package manager, yum, is terribly slow to start up. |
| 14:13 | <@ToxicFrog> | On the other hand, unlike apt-get, it actually works. |
| 14:15 | <@ToxicFrog> | At any rate, if you do create two /s, if you find out it's not working for you you can easily install a different linux alongside it and try that instead. |
| 14:17 | <@Reiver> | I can't even get my drives to mount as it is. >.> |
| 14:17 | <@ToxicFrog> | ? |
| 14:18 | <@Reiver> | Y'know how I set up a 'files' partition? |
| 14:18 | <@Reiver> | I, uh. |
| 14:18 | <@Reiver> | Never did work out why it wasn't mounting... >.> |
| 14:18 | <@ToxicFrog> | No, I don't know. |
| 14:19 | <@Reiver> | Oh. |
| 14:19 | <@Reiver> | You threw a rarball at me with XP ext2 drivers on it... |
| 14:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | Backstory? |
| 14:19 | <@Reiver> | So I could have a partition that held general data on my linux box, which also carries a WinXP partition. |
| 14:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | Oh, that! |
| 14:19 | <@Reiver> | Yes. |
| 14:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yes! |
| 14:19 | <@Reiver> | Er. |
| 14:19 | <@Reiver> | :) |
| 14:20 | <@ToxicFrog> | Can't mount it from inside windows, or inside linux? |
| 14:20 | <@Reiver> | Inside /linux/. |
| 14:20 | <@Reiver> | Go figure I know. |
| 14:21 | | Serah [~Shemhazai@Nightstar-8502.ds1-ba.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Connection reset by peer] |
| 14:21 | <@ToxicFrog> | Well, what error does it present? |
| 14:21 | < Reivlin> | mount: can't find /dev/hda2 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab |
| 14:21 | < Reivlin> | Please check that the device is plugged correctly. |
| 14:21 | <@Reiver> | (I was getting to that.) |
| 14:22 | <@ToxicFrog> | You're just doing "mount /dev/hda2", aren't you. |
| 14:22 | | Serah [~Shemhazai@Nightstar-8502.ds1-ba.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #Code |
| 14:23 | <@Reiver> | I'm right-clicknig the pretty icon? >.> |
| 14:23 | <@Reiver> | (So yes, most probably.) |
| 14:23 | <@Reiver> | (this is wrong?) |
| 14:23 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...icon? |
| 14:24 | <@Reiver> | Ubuntu GUI. |
| 14:24 | <@Reiver> | Rightclick -. Mount. |
| 14:24 | <@ToxicFrog> | Right-click on /what/? The icon for /dev/hda2? |
| 14:24 | <@Reiver> | Right. |
| 14:24 | <@ToxicFrog> | Anyways. There's two ways, in general, to mount something. |
| 14:25 | <@ToxicFrog> | You can tell it mount the device, in which case it looks it up in /etc/fstab to see /where/ it should mount it, and then it does so. |
| 14:25 | <@ToxicFrog> | Or, you can tell it mount the device and give it a location to mount it on, in which case no fstab entry is necessary. |
| 14:25 | <@Reiver> | ...right. |
| 14:25 | <@Reiver> | I need it do it the hard way? |
| 14:28 | <@ToxicFrog> | Well. Either: |
| 14:28 | <@ToxicFrog> | # mount /dev/hda2 /files |
| 14:28 | <@ToxicFrog> | In the shell, or edit /etc/fstab (ubuntu might have a nice graphical wrapper for this or something) and right-click mount. |
| 14:28 | <@ToxicFrog> | Editing /etc/fstab has the additional advantage that you can flag it to automatically mount on boot. |
| 14:32 | <@ToxicFrog> | At which point you no longer have to worry about it at all. |
| 14:33 | < Reivlin> | mount: mount point /files does not exist |
| 14:33 | < Reivlin> | So now I shall try the second option. |
| 14:33 | <@ToxicFrog> | Well, replace /files with wherever you wanted to mount it. |
| 14:33 | <@ToxicFrog> | I was just using it as an example. |
| 14:33 | < Reivlin> | That wsa where I wanted yes. |
| 14:33 | <@ToxicFrog> | Oh. # mkdir /files |
| 14:33 | < Reivlin> | But it didn't work. ;) |
| 14:33 | <@ToxicFrog> | You'll need to do that anyways for either option to work; the mountpoint directory has to exist before you can mount stuff under it. |
| 14:34 | < Reivlin> | mount /dev/hda2 mkdir /files |
| 14:34 | < Reivlin> | ? |
| 14:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | No. |
| 14:34 | < Reivlin> | Ah. |
| 14:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | # mkdir files |
| 14:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | # mount /dev/hda2 /files |
| 14:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | Err. |
| 14:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | # mkdir /files |
| 14:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | # mount /dev/hda2 /files |
| 14:36 | < Reivlin> | ...YAY |
| 14:36 | | * Reivlin hugs TF! |
| 14:36 | < Reivlin> | It WERKS |
| 14:36 | <@ToxicFrog> | Now, you probably want to edit /etc/fstab anyways so that it does this automatically from now on :P |
| 14:37 | < Reivlin> | probably. |
| 14:37 | < Reivlin> | But it WERKS. |
| 14:37 | | * Reivlin nanos the file anyway. |
| 14:39 | < Reivlin> | ...Remind me what exactly I want to type in the hard way. |
| 14:40 | < Reivlin> | # <file system> <mount point> <type> <options> <dump> <pass> |
| 14:40 | < Reivlin> | proc /proc proc defaults 0 0 |
| 14:40 | < Reivlin> | /dev/hda3 / ext3 defaults,errors=remount-ro 0 1 |
| 14:40 | < Reivlin> | /dev/hda5 none swap sw 0 0 |
| 14:40 | < Reivlin> | /dev/hdc /media/cdrom0 udf,iso9660 user,noauto 0 0 |
| 14:40 | < Reivlin> | "/dev/hda /files" but what about the rest? |
| 14:41 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | What format is the files partition in? |
| 14:42 | < Reivlin> | ext2 |
| 14:42 | <@ToxicFrog> | /dev/hda2 /files ext2 defaults 0 0 |
| 14:42 | <@ToxicFrog> | It' |
| 14:43 | <@ToxicFrog> | It's: <<device>> <<mountpoint>> <<filesystem>> <<options>> <<dump frequency>> <<fsck pass number>> |
| 14:43 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...and, actually, you should probably have it as 0 2, not 0 0 |
| 14:43 | <@ToxicFrog> | Device is the underlying device, /dev/hda2 |
| 14:44 | <@ToxicFrog> | Mountpoint is where you want to mount it. |
| 14:44 | <@ToxicFrog> | Type is the filesystem type, in this case ext2 |
| 14:44 | < Reivlin> | I assume you destroy everything horribly if you get htat bit wrong? |
| 14:44 | <@ToxicFrog> | (I believe you can also specify "auto" here and it will try to autodetect) |
| 14:44 | <@ToxicFrog> | No, it just refuses to mount. |
| 14:44 | < Reivlin> | ah, 'k |
| 14:45 | < Reivlin> | options, well, don't-touch-and-we'll-be-fine, the last two? |
| 14:45 | <@ToxicFrog> | Options are the various mount options; these include things like ro (read only), user (users can mount and unmount this), noauto (don't automount on boot), etc. |
| 14:45 | | * Reivlin nods. |
| 14:45 | <@ToxicFrog> | Dump is the frequency with which to back up this filesystem using dump(8), or 0 to skip it. |
| 14:46 | < Reivlin> | Ah! |
| 14:46 | < Reivlin> | Go on. |
| 14:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | Pass is the order in which to check this filesystem with fsck(8), when necessary; 0 is skip, 1 is / and everything else you want to check should be 2 or higher. |
| 14:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | The fifth field, (fs_freq), is used for these filesystems by the dump(8) command to determine which filesystems need to be |
| 14:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | dumped. If the fifth field is not present, a value of zero is returned and dump will assume that the filesystem does not |
| 14:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | need to be dumped. |
| 14:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | The sixth field, (fs_passno), is used by the fsck(8) program to determine the order in which filesystem checks are done at |
| 14:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | reboot time. The root filesystem should be specified with a fs_passno of 1, and other filesystems should have a fs_passno of |
| 14:47 | <@ToxicFrog> | 2. Filesystems within a drive will be checked sequentially, but filesystems on different drives will be checked at the same |
| 14:47 | <@ToxicFrog> | time to utilize parallelism available in the hardware. If the sixth field is not present or zero, a value of zero is |
| 14:47 | < Reivlin> | ...right. |
| 14:47 | <@ToxicFrog> | returned and fsck will assume that the filesystem does not need to be checked. |
| 14:47 | < Reivlin> | So, backup, y/n?, and diskcheck, order/y/n? |
| 14:47 | < Reivlin> | Are the last two numbers? |
| 14:48 | <@ToxicFrog> | backup:frequency and diskcheck:priority. |
| 14:48 | < Reivlin> | Right. |
| 14:48 | < Reivlin> | Cool. |
| 14:48 | < Reivlin> | Ok. |
| 14:48 | < Reivlin> | Thanks. |
| 14:48 | | * Reivlin now tries to remember how to save in nano. |
| 14:48 | < Reivlin> | WriteOut? |
| 14:48 | <@ToxicFrog> | Backup should be set to 0 unless you really know what you're doing (and have dump(8) configured and a backup device handy and so forth) |
| 14:48 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yes. |
| 14:48 | < Reivlin> | Right. |
| 14:49 | <@ToxicFrog> | And diskcheck should be set to 0 (to never check this drive for errors) or 2. |
| 14:49 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | Ctrl+o then Ctrl+x to quite IIRC |
| 14:49 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | -e |
| 14:49 | < Reivlin> | ...Note to self. |
| 14:49 | < Reivlin> | REMEMBER TO SUDO BEFORE EDITING |
| 14:49 | | * Reivlin headdesk. |
| 14:49 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | Never set an ext2/3 drive to diskcheck 0 in fstab, also ;) |
| 14:50 | | Chalcedon [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 14:50 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | Doing so will lead to woe and an entire confectionary factory of biscuits eventually. |
| 14:50 | | Chalcedon [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #code |
| 14:50 | | mode/#code [+o Chalcedon] by ChanServ |
| 14:50 | <@ToxicFrog> | Reivlin: "sudo bash", then work in that shell >.> |
| 14:51 | | * ToxicFrog flails at his hedgehog, which is refusing to boot completely and I can't seem to get into the BIOS over the serial console. |
| 14:51 | < Reivlin> | ...That can't be healthy? |
| 14:51 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | Sound sliek someone has spiked it |
| 14:52 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | (eugh, this transcription stuff really buggers my typing up) |
| 14:52 | < Reivlin> | It appears to have been run over, TF. |
| 14:52 | < Reivlin> | Positively flat. |
| 14:52 | < Reivlin> | (Sorry.) |
| 14:52 | | Reiver is now known as ReivZzz |
| 14:52 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | Night Reiv |
| 14:52 | <@ReivZzz> | Thankye, folks. |
| 14:52 | <@ReivZzz> | I unow sorta understand mounting stuff! |
| 14:53 | <@ToxicFrog> | Well, the "refusing to boot completely" could be either an issue with the linux install (since this is custom hardware not meant to run anything but SGOS) or a problem with the buzzing noise and burning smell that occured when I tried giving it a video card, although I /think/ that damage was localized to the PCI port. |
| 14:53 | <@ToxicFrog> | Certainly it still POSTs, it just won't boot into linux. |
| 14:53 | <@ReivZzz> | ...Oh my /heavens/ is the resolution on the other machine different O.o |
| 14:53 | | * ReivZzz did not realise until just now. |
| 14:53 | <@ToxicFrog> | The "unable to get into the BIOS over the serial console" appears to just be poor design. |
| 14:54 | <@ToxicFrog> | Hah! |
| 14:54 | <@ToxicFrog> | I /can/ get into the BIOS over the serial console! |
| 14:54 | <@ToxicFrog> | I just have to madly spam DEL. |
| 15:03 | <@ToxicFrog> | ....dammit. |
| 15:03 | <@ToxicFrog> | Regardless of the settings in the BIOS, grub uses 9600.8n1. |
| 15:03 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | Gnah |
| 15:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | So the BIOS runs fine at 115200.8n1, but then it kicks into GRUB and I get garbage all over the screen. |
| 15:04 | <@ToxicFrog> | This is probably configurable, but I need to boot the system to be able to edit grub.conf ;.; |
| 15:07 | <@ToxicFrog> | ....oh shit |
| 15:07 | <@ToxicFrog> | I bumped spacebar while it was POSTing. |
| 15:07 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | On a SG box, not good? |
| 15:08 | <@ToxicFrog> | Nvm, false alarm. |
| 15:09 | <@ToxicFrog> | AMIBIOS box, not good. |
| 15:09 | <@ToxicFrog> | Space in the first few seconds of POST is "flash to latest BIOS version" |
| 15:09 | <@ReivZzz> | ... |
| 15:09 | <@ReivZzz> | ew. |
| 15:11 | <@ToxicFrog> | Anyways. BIOS sorted, but Linux still will not boot. |
| 15:12 | <@ToxicFrog> | Now, what I want to ultimately do is install Gentoo on this thing to play around with. |
| 15:13 | <@ToxicFrog> | However, the Gentoo install instructions are all "first, boot the Gentoo install CD - oh, you don't have a CD drive? AHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA SUCKS TO BE YOU" |
| 15:15 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | No USB port either, I'mguessing? |
| 15:15 | <@ToxicFrog> | Two USB ports. |
| 15:15 | <@ToxicFrog> | I'm going to try putting a minimal Linux system on one of my USB keys, along with the stage3 tarball, booting off that, and installing by hand using the hideous maze that is the gentoo documentation. |
| 15:17 | <@TheWatcher[wr0k]> | They are soewhat designed for people with a x86 box and a net connection.. |
| 15:18 | <@ToxicFrog> | And a CD drive. |
| 15:18 | <@ToxicFrog> | It's an x86 box with a net connection and no CD drive. |
| 15:18 | | EvilNromingLord is now known as EvilDarkLord |
| 15:23 | <@ToxicFrog> | There are instructions on the Gentoo fora about building a Gentoo USB stick to install from, but they require you to have an existing Gentoo box on which to build the image! |
| 15:30 | < EvilDarkLord> | Hm. Could you download the image from somewhere? |
| 15:32 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yes. My current plan is to download the smallest install CD, copy the files onto my USB stick, then take apart the ISOLINUX config files on the CD to find out what options I should pass to grub. |
| 15:33 | <@ToxicFrog> | Assuming Gentoo will even work over the serial console. I still don't know if the reason it won't boot is because the install is hosed or because it can't coexist peacefully with the serial console. |
| 16:29 | | EvilDarkLord is now known as Thokk |
| 16:43 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| 17:23 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[afk] |
| 18:35 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| 19:40 | | Thokk is now known as EvilDarkLord |
| 20:53 | < Lukhan> | You can install gentoo with any functional system. All you need is links and a hard drive to boot onto. :P |
| 20:53 | < Lukhan> | the smallest install CD is, well, fucking tiny. |
| 20:53 | < Lukhan> | I have a friend who actually installed gentoo on his ubuntu system while booted into ubuntu. |
| 21:11 | <@ToxicFrog> | Lukhan: oh, I'm confident it can be /done/. |
| 21:12 | <@ToxicFrog> | The installation just doesn't make any mention of it, because it blithely assumes that of course everyone has a CD drive. |
| 21:12 | <@ToxicFrog> | *installation documentation. |
| 21:13 | | Mahal [~Mahal@Nightstar-5192.worldnet.co.nz] has joined #code |
| 21:13 | | mode/#code [+o Mahal] by ChanServ |
| 21:13 | < Lukhan> | ... wtf don't you have one :P |
| 21:13 | <@ToxicFrog> | This is in drastic contrast to, say, the Debian installation docs and procecedures. |
| 21:13 | < Lukhan> | mm. era, really. debian is much older. |
| 21:13 | <@ToxicFrog> | Because I'm installing it on an SG-200. |
| 21:13 | < Lukhan> | hard to find cdless computers nowadays. |
| 21:13 | <@ToxicFrog> | Which doesn't have the physical capacity, controllers, power or cables to support an optical drive, because it doesn't need one. |
| 21:14 | < Lukhan> | mm. honestly ... most of the directions are the /same/ no matter what. |
| 21:14 | < Lukhan> | All you need to do is get booted into /any/ unix environment as root. |
| 21:14 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yes, except for getting the system into a state where you can follow those instructions. |
| 21:15 | < Lukhan> | ... what architecture is an SG-200? |
| 21:15 | <@ToxicFrog> | TransMeta emulating x86. |
| 21:17 | < Lukhan> | http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook-x86.xml?part=1&chap=4 <-- This is where to start, if you're booted into a functional linux environment as root. |
| 21:17 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yes, I know. |
| 21:17 | <@TheWatcher> | The problem TF is having is getting that far. |
| 21:18 | <@ToxicFrog> | The problem lies in actually booting into a function linux environment as root. |
| 21:18 | < Lukhan> | If you want to use some incredibly obscure system, then you get to put up with the difficulties inherent in doing so. :p |
| 21:18 | < Lukhan> | and you're going to have that problem with any distro I know of. |
| 21:18 | <@ToxicFrog> | Fedora Core 5 and Debian both installed without difficulty. |
| 21:18 | < Lukhan> | ... so use one of those. |
| 21:19 | < Lukhan> | su to root, install gentoo. |
| 21:19 | < Lukhan> | done! |
| 21:19 | < Lukhan> | :P |
| 21:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...if it were that simple, I would have done so already. |
| 21:19 | <@ToxicFrog> | Had you bothered to read the backscroll, you would know that the system is not currently in a bootable state, due to a hardware failure. |
| 21:19 | < Lukhan> | I had read. That was not clear from what I read. |
| 21:19 | < Lukhan> | more accurately it looked like it had been fixed. |
| 21:20 | < Lukhan> | Do you know how to make a system try to boot from USB? |
| 21:20 | < Lukhan> | I don't. I don't know if it's /possible/. |
| 21:20 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yes. That is how I installed Fedora 5. |
| 21:20 | < Lukhan> | Then how did you get it to boot from USB for Fedora 5? |
| 21:21 | <@ToxicFrog> | Plug in USB key, enter BIOS, configure it to boot from USB. |
| 21:21 | <@ToxicFrog> | I note that this was back when it was still physically possible to attach a video card. |
| 21:21 | < Lukhan> | ... so basically you can't boot because you can't configure your bios because you have no video card? |
| 21:22 | <@ToxicFrog> | If Debian provided USB boot images, I would try those, in the hopes it would be unaffected by the...issues that appear to arise with the serial console. |
| 21:22 | <@ToxicFrog> | However, it doesn't. |
| 21:22 | <@ToxicFrog> | Err. Gentoo, not Debian. |
| 21:22 | < Lukhan> | Fedora has a USB boot image? |
| 21:22 | <@ToxicFrog> | I can get into the BIOS. The problem is that I can't disable the serial console, because that is the only means of access I have. |
| 21:23 | <@ToxicFrog> | And my experience has shown that Linux appears to have issues with the serial console. |
| 21:23 | < Lukhan> | Okay. I have the solution. It is a two-stage solution. |
| 21:23 | < Lukhan> | Step one: Knoppix. |
| 21:23 | < Lukhan> | Step two: Gentoo. |
| 21:24 | <@TheWatcher> | See also: no CD drive |
| 21:24 | < Lukhan> | there's a pure-USB knoppix version. |
| 21:25 | < Lukhan> | Alternatively. |
| 21:25 | < Lukhan> | http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/liveusb.xml <-- per the gentoo site. |
| 21:25 | < Lukhan> | Do you have any computer running a linux distro you can use? |
| 21:26 | <@ToxicFrog> | Instructions that would be very hand if I already had Gentoo and thus emerge. |
| 21:27 | < Lukhan> | yes. you don't actually need emerge if you pay attention. Do you, or do you not, have a linux system /other/ than the one that doesn't work? |
| 21:28 | < Lukhan> | It doesn't need to be gentoo. |
| 21:28 | < Lukhan> | Just that they can't provide step-by-step instructions for every single non-gentoo distro. |
| 21:28 | <@ToxicFrog> | I have several. |
| 21:29 | < Lukhan> | If you can get syslinux, make the USB stick a fat32 partition, copy the minimal install cd files onto the USB stick, then modify them to use syslinux as it describes, you can do it. |
| 21:30 | < Lukhan> | that guide only uses emerge in order to ensure you can do those first two things. |
| 21:30 | < Lukhan> | if you can make it a fat32 partition in another way, and can get syslinux another way, you're fine. |
| 21:31 | < Lukhan> | you could presumeably get syslinux via direct download from here: http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/utils/boot/syslinux/ |
| 21:32 | <@ToxicFrog> | I already have it installed, for some of my other experiments. |
| 21:32 | < Lukhan> | making a fat32 partition should be within your abilities. Use a windows machine if you have to. :p |
| 21:32 | < Lukhan> | okay then! |
| 21:32 | | * Lukhan summarizes the guide: |
| 21:33 | < Lukhan> | 1) Make a FAT32 partition on the USB stick. (of at least 64mb size) |
| 21:33 | < Lukhan> | 2) Install syslinux's MBR on the USB stick. |
| 21:33 | < Lukhan> | 3) Copy all the minimal install files to the USB stick. (simple recursive copy.) |
| 21:34 | < Lukhan> | 4) move the isolinux directory on the USB stick to the USB stick's root dir. |
| 21:34 | < Lukhan> | 5) rename isolinux.cfg to syslinux.cfg |
| 21:34 | | * TheWatcher ponders Lukhan, wonders if he has the blindest clue about who TF is and what he does for a living |
| 21:34 | | * Mahal suspects not. |
| 21:34 | < Lukhan> | Nope! |
| 21:35 | <@TheWatcher> | Yes, I suspected as much |
| 21:36 | < Lukhan> | hmm. I see I've been being an ass, now that I finally worked out that TF and Reiver are different people. |
| 21:36 | | * Lukhan whistles innocently and backs out of the channel slowly. |
| 21:36 | | Lukhan [~Sotek@Nightstar-5062.hsd1.de.comcast.net] has left #code [Leaving] |
| 21:36 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...you were unaware of this? |
| 21:36 | <@ToxicFrog> | ... |
| 21:36 | <@Mahal> | ... |
| 21:36 | <@ToxicFrog> | Ok, that was odd. |
| 21:36 | | * Mahal giggles |
| 21:38 | | * TheWatcher eyebrows |
| 21:40 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...Hmm. There's /definitely/ something not entirely right with this system. |
| 21:40 | <@ToxicFrog> | This time it died halfway through a boot message. |
| 21:40 | <@ToxicFrog> | hda: ST340014A, ATA DISK drive |
| 21:40 | <@ToxicFrog> | ide0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7,0x3f6 on i |
| 21:58 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[afk] |
| 22:25 | | MahalWork [~Mahal@Nightstar-5192.worldnet.co.nz] has joined #Code |
| 22:25 | | mode/#code [+o MahalWork] by ChanServ |
| 22:30 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| 22:30 | <@Mahal> | wb Watcher. |
| 22:30 | <@TheWatcher> | Ta |
| 22:48 | | Chalcedon [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 22:53 | | Chalcedon [~Chalceon@Nightstar-869.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #code |
| 22:53 | | mode/#code [+o Chalcedon] by ChanServ |
| 22:57 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 22:58 | <@TheWatcher[T-2]> | Night all |
| 22:58 | <@Chalcedon> | night~ |
| 22:58 | <@Chalcedon> | *! |
| 23:00 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[afk] |
| 23:07 | | Mahal [~Mahal@Nightstar-5192.worldnet.co.nz] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] |
| 23:07 | | Mahal [~Mahal@Nightstar-5192.worldnet.co.nz] has joined #code |
| 23:08 | | mode/#code [+o Mahal] by ChanServ |
| --- Log closed Tue Aug 08 00:00:02 2006 |