| --- Log opened Mon Nov 09 00:00:04 2020 |
| 00:13 | | Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody[zZz] |
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| 02:31 | < Yossarian> | McMartin: interesting |
| 04:32 | <&McMartin> | New Bumbershoot Software post. https://bumbershootsoft.wordpress.com/2020/11/09/building-a-faster-c64-bitmap-library/ |
| 04:38 | < Yossarian> | [R]: wasn't there some plugin for browser you were telling me about that lets you change rules about how the page is rendered? |
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| 04:48 | < Yossarian> | McMartin: thanks, that's a cool link... did C64 have easy access to assembler for it? |
| 04:49 | <&McMartin> | Many, but standard practice nowadays is to use one of many excellent cross-assemblers. |
| 04:50 | <&McMartin> | One of the quirks of the C64's disks was that the DOS was burned into ROMs on the drives themselves, which had their own CPUs. So the main computer sent commands down a serial port and got file data back |
| 04:50 | <&McMartin> | This means that it's trivial to have an emulator use a modern filesystem to pose as a floppy drive of improbable size, so that makes it even easier to cross-develop. |
| 04:51 | <&McMartin> | The 6502 assembler I use for my articles is one that I wrote myself 20 years ago because I didn't like the tools I had found at the time. I've stuck with it out of inertia, but it's still my most popular project actually primarily written by me. |
| 04:51 | < Yossarian> | when you say "the drives themselves" you mean the disk drives? I forget the model # of the 5" floppy |
| 04:52 | <&McMartin> | 1541, 1541-II, or 1571. |
| 04:52 | < Yossarian> | but I know there are lots of tricks for these older systems, I'm just wondering aloud |
| 04:53 | <&McMartin> | Yeah. I haven't really gotten into "fastloaders" -- you could replace the DOS over the serial line, in part, feeding it code to run to load faster or off of custom disk formats and such. |
| 04:53 | <&McMartin> | You saw less of this on the Commodore machines. |
| 04:53 | <&McMartin> | I spent most of 2015 and 2016 tearing down the basic tricks for the C64 graphics chips on that site. |
| 04:55 | <&McMartin> | The C64 executable format is also dirt-simple, which is nice |
| 04:55 | <&McMartin> | A lot of older platforms you need to do some post-processing to get a binary produced by a build system into a form an emulator can load. |
| 04:56 | < Yossarian> | had C64 or two when I had a family but wasn't old enough to use them, I bought one at a yard sale in 2002 or such |
| 04:56 | <&McMartin> | C64 it's a 2-byte header for the file, and then 12 or 13 bytes of boilerplate and you can just stick a machine language program after that and everything loads and runs fine without BASIC ever thinking anything strange has happened. |
| 05:00 | <&McMartin> | My favorite work of madness so far though involved The Worst Type-In Program Ever, for the Atari 800: https://bumbershootsoft.wordpress.com/2019/08/24/atari-800-repairing-a-mad-science-type-in/ |
| 05:02 | <&McMartin> | A program with two remarkable properties: |
| 05:02 | <&McMartin> | - The correctness of the program depended on the order in which you typed in its lines |
| 05:02 | <&McMartin> | - Typing in the program beginning-to-end was not an order that gave you a correct program |
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| 05:04 | < Yossarian> | ! |
| 05:04 | < Pink> | Jeeze |
| 05:05 | <&McMartin> | Once I got it working it was pretty great |
| 05:05 | <&McMartin> | But getting it to work given the listing was kind of nuts |
| 05:35 | <&[R]> | Yossarian: Greasemonkey or Stylish are the only kinds of things I can remember |
| 06:05 | < Yossarian> | Greasemonkey, I think. I'm looking for a way to make all blogs/pages into "dark" mode. |
| 06:07 | <&[R]> | Stylish would be better suited for that |
| 06:07 | <&[R]> | They both do the same thing, just Greasemonkey is for JS, and Stylish is for CSS |
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| 06:10 | | mode/#code [+qo Vorntastic Vorntastic] by ChanServ |
| 06:10 | < Yossarian> | McMartin: your blog is wicked sick |
| 06:13 | < Yossarian> | [R]: I'm doing projects wrong. I should have ~/proj/projName and iteratively build upon them (the projects). |
| 06:15 | <&[R]> | What are you doing now? |
| 06:15 | <&[R]> | Or before rather |
| 06:26 | < Yossarian> | whimsy |
| 06:26 | < Yossarian> | unorganized whismy |
| 06:40 | < Yossarian> | Like, I'm curious about 3d programming basics, I could probably write a basic software renderer |
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| 06:51 | <~Vorntastic> | Shaders! Shaders! Shaders! *Pounds on the table in time* |
| 07:07 | < Yossarian> | well I don't know much about it but I have a friend who says it's not so difficult to get started to learn |
| 07:08 | < Yossarian> | be interested to write it in C or C++ and perhaps make Lua a sort of console to make dynamic changes |
| 07:13 | <&McMartin> | This is an excellent tutorial for modern 3D graphics https://paroj.github.io/gltut/ |
| 07:18 | <&McMartin> | Also thank you for the kind words |
| 07:30 | < Yossarian> | I saw that. |
| 07:30 | < Yossarian> | I also know of a software renderer tutorial that I've seen on youtube or github, maybe both. |
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| 08:21 | < ErikMesoy> | I have received a fascinating Excel sheet of power draw data. |
| 08:21 | < ErikMesoy> | Column header titles are calculated as equations by 'adding' text from two different cells. |
| 08:22 | < ErikMesoy> | Column entries for averages are written directly in as numbers with 12 decimals. |
| 08:22 | <~Vorntastic> | That *is* fascinating |
| 08:25 | < ErikMesoy> | The averages are of other numbers in the sheet, just to be clear. |
| 08:30 | < Yossarian> | in tsv or csv? |
| 08:30 | < Yossarian> | awk! |
| 08:32 | < ErikMesoy> | xlsx. |
| 08:35 | < Yossarian> | hmm |
| 08:38 | < Yossarian> | wonder if there is a way to convert spreadsheet with built in referential calculations based on other row/column into csv or tsv and render the calculation with g/awk or such |
| 08:39 | < Yossarian> | probably but not without some pain |
| 08:40 | <&[R]> | Gnumeric possibly? It has a mode to take an excel file and create something usable out of it |
| 08:40 | <&[R]> | Via the VLI |
| 08:40 | <&[R]> | CLI* |
| 08:46 | < Yossarian> | I tried with a summing of 3 numbers but the results are fixed |
| 08:46 | < ErikMesoy> | Excel has a "Paste Values" option when copying from formula cells. |
| 08:46 | < Yossarian> | when exported as csv |
| 08:46 | < ErikMesoy> | Copy and paste internally before exporting? |
| 09:52 | | Kindamoody[zZz] is now known as Kindamoody |
| 10:09 | < catalyst> | working with this new codebase reminds me that I am in fact a very competent programmer |
| 10:12 | <~Vorntastic> | In what way |
| 10:15 | < catalyst> | I have the ability to quickly assess details of what a lot of the primitive parts of it do |
| 10:15 | < catalyst> | and have informed opinions on them very quickly |
| 10:15 | < catalyst> | and this pleases me |
| 10:16 | < catalyst> | (and, more importantly, figure out what questions I want to ask about it to learn more) |
| 10:18 | <~Vorntastic> | Oh that's good |
| 11:15 | <&[R]> | __SECRET_INTERNALS_DO_NOT_USE_OR_YOU_WILL_BE_FIRED: { |
| 11:15 | <&[R]> | Events: [me, ve, ye, F.injectEventPluginsByName, p, _e, function(e) { |
| 11:15 | <&[R]> | n(e, Se) |
| 11:15 | <&[R]> | }, qn, Kn, Fl, U, Hb, ew] |
| 11:15 | <&[R]> | } |
| 11:15 | <&[R]> | HMMMMMM |
| 11:21 | <~Vorntastic> | Hahaha |
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| 11:32 | <&[R]> | "from the same file: SECRET_DO_NOT_PASS_THIS_OR_YOU_WILL_BE_FIRED" |
| 11:34 | | * TheWatcher eyes |
| 11:35 | <&[R]> | Imagine working at a company that has code that you'll be fired for using |
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| 11:54 | < catalyst> | heh |
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| 16:40 | | * gnolam >_<s. |
| 16:42 | <@gnolam> | A program I'm maintaining really brings home the truth of "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." |
| 16:43 | <@gnolam> | They keep finding new and interesting ways to break it. |
| 16:47 | <@gnolam> | This time, some lab techs down in Europe should either get an intervention for their crack habits or a Nobel prize. |
| 16:49 | <@gnolam> | Because they have either *spectacularly* messed up their production data or discovered the secret of overunity energy. |
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| 19:01 | <&McMartin> | There is a much older proverb to the effect that one cannot make anything foolproof, because fools are so ingenious |
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| --- Log closed Tue Nov 10 00:00:06 2020 |