| --- Log opened Mon Oct 31 00:00:11 2016 |
| 00:00 | | Vash [Vash@Nightstar-uhn82m.ct.comcast.net] has quit [[NS] Quit: Quit] |
| 00:30 | <&McMartin> | http://wccftech.com/nvidia-gtx-1080-1070-evga-cards-dying/ |
| 00:31 | <&McMartin> | Man, I remember back when electronics only caught fire when you configured it *improperly* |
| 00:32 | <@Azash> | McMartin: I remember a guy at my dept wrote a paper on green ICT and using DC exhaust air to heat the building |
| 00:32 | <@Azash> | Only natural to take it to the next level for private consumers |
| 00:35 | | * Alek had a graphics card burn out in like 09/10, at default card configs. |
| 00:36 | <@Alek> | burning caps, ew. I SAW it burning. :P |
| 00:36 | <@Alek> | had to replace the mobo, cpu, and ram too, because even with the card replaced the machine no longer worked. |
| 00:37 | <&McMartin> | Ugh. |
| 00:37 | <&McMartin> | Yeah, my original comment was in reference to igniting CRTs by overdriving their horizontal refresh rate |
| 00:42 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-gi5itv.dab.02.net] has joined #code |
| 00:49 | <&McMartin> | Aha, I see, yeah, this is an overclocking issue and also just a high-ambient issue, it seems |
| 00:49 | <&McMartin> | https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/58p5z2/evga_response_to_gtx_1080_1070 _high_memory/ |
| 00:49 | <&McMartin> | This seems pretty mensch-y |
| 00:52 | | catalyst [catalyst@Nightstar-bt5k4h.81.in-addr.arpa] has quit [[NS] Quit: Leaving] |
| 03:37 | | Alek [Alek@Nightstar-cltq0r.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 03:45 | | Alek [Alek@Nightstar-cltq0r.il.comcast.net] has joined #code |
| 03:45 | | mode/#code [+o Alek] by ChanServ |
| 04:23 | | Derakon is now known as Derakon[AFK] |
| 04:38 | | Vornicus [Vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 04:45 | | Vornicus [Vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has joined #code |
| 04:45 | | mode/#code [+qo Vornicus Vornicus] by ChanServ |
| 06:38 | | catadruid [catalyst@Nightstar-vdpa1t.dab.02.net] has joined #code |
| 06:41 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-gi5itv.dab.02.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 08:01 | | Kindamoody[zZz] is now known as Kindamoody |
| 08:02 | | celticminstrel [celticminst@Nightstar-5boimd.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [[NS] Quit: And lo! The computer falls into a deep sleep, to awake again some other day!] |
| 09:12 | | Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody|afk |
| 10:03 | | catadruid is now known as catadroid |
| 10:41 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-vdpa1t.dab.02.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 10:59 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-vdpa1t.dab.02.net] has joined #code |
| 12:08 | < catadroid> | C++ really despises having to copy any data |
| 12:50 | < catadroid> | Well, our classes do anyway. I guess C++ actually rather perversely enjoys it in general |
| 13:08 | | catadruid [catalyst@Nightstar-tt8rht.dab.02.net] has joined #code |
| 13:11 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-vdpa1t.dab.02.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 13:19 | <~Vornicus> | yeah, C++ is all about dat copy unless you tell it otherwiser |
| 13:48 | | gnolam_ [lenin@Nightstar-t1tbf0.cust.bahnhof.se] has joined #code |
| 13:48 | | gnolam [lenin@Nightstar-t1tbf0.cust.bahnhof.se] has quit [NickServ (RECOVER command used by gnolam_)] |
| 13:48 | | gnolam_ is now known as gnolam |
| 13:48 | | mode/#code [+o gnolam] by ChanServ |
| 14:39 | | macdjord is now known as macdjord|wurk |
| 14:49 | | Vash [Vash@Nightstar-uhn82m.ct.comcast.net] has joined #code |
| 16:27 | | Alek [Alek@Nightstar-cltq0r.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 16:30 | | Alek [Alek@Nightstar-cltq0r.il.comcast.net] has joined #code |
| 16:30 | | mode/#code [+o Alek] by ChanServ |
| 16:37 | | gizmore|2 [kvirc@Nightstar-digmob.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Operation timed out] |
| 16:37 | | gizmore|2 [kvirc@Nightstar-jrjsqj.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #code |
| 16:43 | | celticminstrel [celticminst@Nightstar-5boimd.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #code |
| 16:43 | | mode/#code [+o celticminstrel] by ChanServ |
| 17:10 | | Derakon [chriswei@Nightstar-5mvs4e.ca.comcast.net] has joined #code |
| 17:10 | | mode/#code [+ao Derakon Derakon] by ChanServ |
| 17:14 | | Derakon[AFK] [chriswei@Nightstar-5mvs4e.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 18:37 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-tt8rht.dab.02.net] has joined #code |
| 18:37 | | catadruid [catalyst@Nightstar-tt8rht.dab.02.net] has quit [The TLS connection was non-properly terminated.] |
| 18:42 | | catadruid [catalyst@Nightstar-tt8rht.dab.02.net] has joined #code |
| 18:42 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-tt8rht.dab.02.net] has quit [The TLS connection was non-properly terminated.] |
| 19:35 | | catalyst [catalyst@Nightstar-bt5k4h.81.in-addr.arpa] has joined #code |
| 19:38 | | Vash [Vash@Nightstar-uhn82m.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Connection closed] |
| 19:38 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-7uddmo.dab.02.net] has joined #code |
| 19:41 | | catadruid [catalyst@Nightstar-tt8rht.dab.02.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 19:42 | | catadroid [catalyst@Nightstar-7uddmo.dab.02.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 21:07 | | * gnolam !s. |
| 21:07 | | * Tamber ?s |
| 21:10 | <@gnolam> | I have been given API specs for a new machine to implement... /and it's sane/. |
| 21:10 | | * Azash &s responsibly |
| 21:10 | <@Tamber> | ...lies. |
| 21:10 | <@Tamber> | and damned lies |
| 21:10 | <@Tamber> | gnolam: Clearly, if they're sane, then they're wrong. |
| 21:11 | <@gnolam> | This is an industry where the only open standard is based on, I shit you not, first negotiating a protocol version by reading and writing to set locations in the Windows registry and then writing and reading data and signal files in magical folders. |
| 21:11 | | * Azash has yet to encounter an API that pleased both the server and client |
| 21:12 | <@Azash> | gnolam: W-what |
| 21:12 | <&McMartin> | Azash: So, like |
| 21:12 | <&McMartin> | gnolam is a real scientist |
| 21:12 | <&McMartin> | It turns out though that we computer "scientists" actually have made progress that we haven't properly, fully shared |
| 21:13 | <@Azash> | McMartin: I mean when you negotiate a protocol version by manipulating the registry the only scientist I can think of is that guy from ATHF |
| 21:14 | <&McMartin> | Right, so, um, hm |
| 21:14 | <&McMartin> | This reference is a little dated, but... |
| 21:14 | <&McMartin> | You know the joke about how the most terrifying thing to hear from your mom/uncle/etc re: 'halp my email doesn't work' is 'wait n/m i solved it'? |
| 21:15 | <&McMartin> | Because it invariably turns out that their 'solution' was to copy paste images out of the web browser through microsoft word and then export as email or something |
| 21:15 | <@Azash> | Yeah? |
| 21:15 | <&McMartin> | ANAICT this is the entire world outside of professional IT, including about half of CS academia |
| 21:15 | <&McMartin> | (I am literally a CD PhD and I can tell you right now you do not want me within 100 meters of an LDAP server) |
| 21:16 | <&McMartin> | *CS |
| 21:16 | <@Azash> | Painful memories of a highly lauded networking pioneer publishing 1-2 times a month since his MSc |
| 21:16 | <@Azash> | "How does this projector work" |
| 21:16 | <&McMartin> | Modularization: Not just for program structure~ |
| 21:17 | <@gnolam> | McMartin: not doing SCIENCE anymore. Now I'm an industry whore! |
| 21:17 | <@Azash> | McMartin: Also for posterity, this guy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W36pKI6qNKo |
| 21:17 | <&McMartin> | gnolam: Strictly speaking, I didn't say you were *doing* science, but rather that you were a scientist |
| 21:18 | <&McMartin> | Also, I would like to note that the last time I was helping out a bioinformatician, they had in fact named all the variables after their favorite movie and videogame characters |
| 21:18 | <@Azash> | Amazing |
| 21:18 | <&McMartin> | So I think some of these things are baked in but we get them out of our system when we were hacking BASIC at age 9 |
| 21:18 | <@Azash> | McMartin: When I started my CS bachelor I spent some four or six weeks going back and forth about whether Horgan or Denning was right |
| 21:18 | <@Azash> | I think you've given me the gift of realization |
| 21:19 | <@Azash> | It's simply a way to protect impressionable younglings from an academic career |
| 21:19 | <@gnolam> | (I got the choice between "continued awesome SCIENCE, but on a project by project basis" and "full-time industry employment with a 100% pay raise to boot". I chose the latter.) |
| 21:19 | <@Azash> | (as in weekly essays) |
| 21:19 | <&McMartin> | I *think* I know what distinction you're trying to make here but can you spell it out? |
| 21:19 | <&McMartin> | Now, it turns out that some of this is our fault too |
| 21:20 | <&McMartin> | Said bioinformatician's co-workers actually tended to name their variables things like 'foo' and 'bar' |
| 21:20 | <&McMartin> | Because that's what all the examples did |
| 21:20 | <&McMartin> | And obviously they are savvily following the obvious best practice |
| 21:20 | <@gnolam> | (... unfortunately, in an industry where software is slapped together by chemists and mechanical engineers. ;_;) |
| 21:20 | <&McMartin> | I think that one's on us. |
| 21:20 | <@gnolam> | (Or, from the look of their APIs, literal witch doctors.) |
| 21:20 | <&McMartin> | Heh |
| 21:20 | <@Azash> | McMartin: Would you say the situation is foobar? |
| 21:20 | <&McMartin> | Azash: I seem to be recognizing the shit out of it, so I think it doesn't even manage that! |
| 21:21 | | * Azash wonders if he's told the CCN story here yet |
| 21:21 | <@Azash> | Just as a tangerine |
| 21:22 | <@Azash> | So I used to be involved as a student representative in various faculty things |
| 21:22 | | * McMartin does some googling, realizes that this the Horgan vs. Denning thing is different than what he thought it was |
| 21:22 | <@Azash> | One of those was being a member of the AP applicant review boards |
| 21:22 | <&McMartin> | On that particular front... |
| 21:22 | <&McMartin> | ... I happen to consider CS to be Applied Philosophy |
| 21:22 | <@Azash> | In particular, I was in the group that reviewed demo lectures |
| 21:22 | <@Azash> | McMartin: Yeah we wrote essay after essay after essay |
| 21:23 | <@Azash> | It really does sap you of your will to write ever again |
| 21:23 | <&McMartin> | Well, it's not just that |
| 21:23 | <@Azash> | So I was on that board |
| 21:23 | <&McMartin> | I took a history of philosophy course as part of my breadth requirements |
| 21:23 | <@Azash> | And we had this one guy who did his lecture on his own specialty |
| 21:23 | <@Azash> | Content-centric networking |
| 21:23 | <&McMartin> | And, uh, yeah, actually, the 19th century analytic philosophy stuff |
| 21:23 | <&McMartin> | ... that looked an awful lot like CS 70 |
| 21:23 | <@Azash> | For those who aren't familiar, it's just the idea that you replace IPv\d+ addressing with resource IDs |
| 21:24 | <@Azash> | And he was very hyped about it |
| 21:24 | <@Azash> | "Finally, we can move past the outdated IP addressing paradigm" etc etc |
| 21:24 | <@Azash> | So he asked if there were questions and I meekly posed, "So.. In practice, how do you actually get your files and find them" |
| 21:25 | <@Azash> | "Well, that's the clever part" |
| 21:25 | <@Azash> | "It can just be built on top of TCP/IP" |
| 21:25 | <&McMartin> | ... so, DNS? |
| 21:26 | <@Azash> | DNS needs addressing unless you somehow solve the problem of decentralized DNS broadcast systems that aren't just going to destroy everything beautiful ever in a way that would make James Mickens stutter |
| 21:26 | <@Azash> | That sentence came out as garbage and I apologize, I just got home |
| 21:27 | <&McMartin> | It's OK, I study German in my spare time >_> |
| 21:27 | <@simon_> | McMartin, so do I! |
| 21:27 | <@Azash> | Anyway yes to sum it up, he was advocating replacing IP addressing with a revolutionary new system that's built on top of IP addressing |
| 21:28 | <&McMartin> | welp |
| 21:28 | <@simon_> | my networking is rusty. why is it you want to replace IP addressing? |
| 21:29 | <@simon_> | surely there are reasons to replace TCP. |
| 21:29 | <@Azash> | simon_: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_centric_networking |
| 21:30 | <@Azash> | simon_: Oh you reminded me of a fantastic Experience the other day |
| 21:30 | <@Azash> | I was getting hounded by a client manager who wouldn't listen to me saying that a particular problem was caused by a misconfigured simulator |
| 21:30 | <@Azash> | The reasoning? |
| 21:31 | <@Azash> | She had seen the logs and noticed in the networking statistics that in the process of sending 47 million UDP packets |
| 21:31 | <@Azash> | One had been lost |
| 21:31 | <@Azash> | Revealing a critical failure in our network stack. |
| 21:31 | | * Azash literally could not get work done before noon because he was being followed everywhere |
| 21:32 | <&McMartin> | Uninterruptible Datagram Protocol |
| 21:32 | <@Azash> | Exactly |
| 21:32 | <@Azash> | I should have promised to roll out the newest version of google maps onto the network to avoid packets getting lost again |
| 21:32 | <@Azash> | She might even have bought it |
| 21:33 | <@gnolam> | :) |
| 21:33 | <@simon_> | Azash, soo... content-centric networking = giant IP-less DHT where you basically ask "DOES ANYONE HAVE SHA512('Google Search')???" |
| 21:34 | <&McMartin> | I mean, my objection to these sorts of things is that as a rule I do not want $FIXED_ITEM |
| 21:35 | <&McMartin> | If I knew what content I wanted, I would have it |
| 21:35 | <@simon_> | the wikipedia page says that content-centric networking is not connection-oriented. but I don't get that - if TCP is in charge of the notion of connections, how does connection-centric networking make IP redundant? |
| 21:35 | <&McMartin> | I want to either interact with some service, or contact a specific machine. |
| 21:35 | <@Azash> | simon_: Simple |
| 21:35 | <@Azash> | The layered nature of networking means that any layer can be seamlessly switched out for another with no problems or complications |
| 21:35 | | * Azash maintains a straight face |
| 21:36 | <&McMartin> | Hey, back in the 80s consumer networking ran on X.25! |
| 21:37 | <@Azash> | I've been yapping on a bunch now but there's one more thing I wanted to share before I tumble into bed |
| 21:37 | <@Azash> | I have to put up with systemd at ${CLIENT}, and was trying to figure out how to configure the log sync rate |
| 21:38 | <@Azash> | And as it turns out, google shares my rather partisan views of said software |
| 21:38 | <@Azash> | http://i.imgur.com/gw6xIET.png |
| 23:05 | <&[R]> | Ga |
| 23:05 | <&[R]> | Ha* |
| 23:10 | | Vash [Vash@Nightstar-uhn82m.ct.comcast.net] has joined #code |
| 23:14 | <@simon_> | private static Tuple<Dictionary<StringTokenization, Dictionary<int, Dictionary<int, Dictionary<int, int>>>>, IEnumerable<AlignedSequence>> GetEditDistancesDistribution(string prefix, IDictionary<StringTokenization, IList<StringWithCompanyInformation>> substringTokenizationsDistribution) |
| 23:16 | <&McMartin> | And the most tragic part is that this symbol is probably 10x smaller than the full symbol name of an equivalent type implemented using standard library types |
| 23:17 | < catalyst> | I once broke the template name limit on the managed C++ compiler |
| 23:18 | < catalyst> | it's 1024 characters |
| 23:18 | <@simon_> | catalyst, sounds like an epic name. |
| 23:18 | < catalyst> | It was entirely generated from one that was about 50 characters long at most |
| 23:18 | <@simon_> | s/epic name/epic (as in the literary genre)/ |
| 23:18 | < catalyst> | templates to select arities, and such |
| 23:18 | < catalyst> | Hey, it worked on the standard compiler |
| 23:19 | < catalyst> | (which had a limit of 4096 characters :s) |
| 23:19 | <@simon_> | what's a managed compiler? |
| 23:19 | < catalyst> | Managed C++ is .NET-ified C++ |
| 23:19 | <@simon_> | oh |
| 23:19 | < catalyst> | basically not-quite-C++-that-has-horrible-.NET-things-in-it |
| 23:19 | < catalyst> | One of the things this lets you do is write templated generics. |
| 23:19 | <@simon_> | well, that's the microsoft mentality. "1024 characters should be enough for everyone!" |
| 23:21 | < catalyst> | I still don't know *why* we had anything written in managed C++ |
| 23:21 | < catalyst> | but |
| 23:21 | < catalyst> | hey, nevermind |
| 23:24 | <&McMartin> | I think my personal record is around 2.5K |
| 23:24 | <&McMartin> | simon_: To be fair |
| 23:25 | <&McMartin> | The fact that 1024 characters for your type name is not enough is a reasonable critique of C++ =P |
| 23:25 | <&McMartin> | Remember, eventually you're going to need to do something with it |
| 23:25 | <&McMartin> | Which means you're going to have to build a symbol out of more than one |
| 23:26 | < catalyst> | ^ |
| 23:41 | | gnolam [lenin@Nightstar-t1tbf0.cust.bahnhof.se] has quit [Connection closed] |
| 23:41 | | gnolam [lenin@Nightstar-t1tbf0.cust.bahnhof.se] has joined #code |
| 23:41 | | mode/#code [+o gnolam] by ChanServ |
| 23:59 | | Kindamoody|afk is now known as Kindamoody |
| --- Log closed Tue Nov 01 00:00:27 2016 |