| --- Log opened Fri Nov 07 00:00:21 2014 |
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| 01:14 | <@Reiv> | help |
| 01:14 | <&McMartin> | Nothing practical results from your prayer. |
| 01:15 | <@Reiv> | snrk |
| 01:15 | <@Reiv> | I have a graph that tracks the difference between two bits of data: The planned time vs the actual time for a given job. |
| 01:15 | <@Reiv> | It lines them up so you can see the 'curve' of how well you estimate a job's time vs how long it takes to actually do |
| 01:16 | <@Reiv> | It initially reported actual numbers |
| 01:16 | <@Reiv> | I now need to report percentages |
| 01:16 | <&McMartin> | "a graph" is vague |
| 01:16 | <@Reiv> | Well, it's mostly background |
| 01:16 | <&McMartin> | If you can do a subtraction and feed the result to something |
| 01:16 | <&McMartin> | Surely you can do the division and feed *that* |
| 01:17 | <@Reiv> | The trick is I'm not sure division is actually the correct path |
| 01:17 | <@Reiv> | They want it so if the Actuals are 2x the Planned, you read the graph as +100% |
| 01:17 | <@Reiv> | If they match, it's +0% |
| 01:18 | <&McMartin> | That's "actual - planned" / "planned", is it not? |
| 01:18 | <@Reiv> | ... ah, that would make more sense |
| 01:18 | <@Reiv> | I was doing Actual / Planned because I am a dumbass~ |
| 01:18 | <&McMartin> | You still have to watch out for when planned is zero~ |
| 01:20 | <@Reiv> | Yeah, I don't know how to handle that case, for honest >_> |
| 01:35 | <@macdjord> | How about log(actual/planned)? |
| 01:41 | <@Reiv> | That would confuse the gorillas, to paraphrase Xenonauts |
| 01:42 | <@macdjord> | Okay, -log(a/p) then. "Big numbers good. Small numbers bad." |
| 01:44 | <@Reiv> | snerk |
| 01:45 | | * Reiv puts in bars, if it breaks because someone submits a Planned Time of 0, they can be shouted at ¬¬ |
| 02:02 | <&McMartin> | OK, the Magicka soundtrack is actually too epic to code to. |
| 02:03 | <@Reiv> | snrk |
| 02:03 | <&McMartin> | (Seriously, it's like they deliberately didn't tell the composer they were making a comedy game) |
| 02:05 | <@Reiv> | (That may have been deliberate) |
| 02:07 | <&McMartin> | I mean, really |
| 02:07 | <&McMartin> | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wImPL1FLuuc |
| 02:09 | | * McMartin switches over to Dustforce. |
| 02:10 | <@Reiv> | You know, I actually liked that part of Magicka |
| 02:10 | <@Reiv> | It helped with the... dissonance, I guess? |
| 02:10 | <@Reiv> | Which added to the comedy |
| 02:10 | <@Reiv> | I don't quite know how to put it |
| 02:10 | <&McMartin> | I mean, there were bits they did on purpose |
| 02:10 | <&McMartin> | Which were also great. |
| 02:10 | <@Reiv> | But if they'd made it 'this is a comedy lolz' it would have made it far more forgettable |
| 02:11 | <&McMartin> | I particularly like that Gram and Tyrfing show up and actually behave in ways recognizable in the sagas |
| 02:11 | <&McMartin> | I'm wondering if this is because they are Swedes |
| 02:11 | <&McMartin> | If you are an American dev, you are unlikely to fuck up Paul Bunyan |
| 02:11 | <@Reiv> | Well, yeah |
| 02:11 | <@Reiv> | I'm just mildly sad that Excalibur was made a joke |
| 02:11 | <&McMartin> | Goddamn Alien Albion, amirite |
| 02:11 | <@Reiv> | By being a sword-handled hammer >_> |
| 02:12 | <&McMartin> | But yeah |
| 02:12 | <@Reiv> | (Who is Paul Bunyan) |
| 02:12 | <&McMartin> | I can totally see them going to the composer and saying "Hi, um" |
| 02:12 | <&McMartin> | "We need a theme for when the heroes face off against motherleeging Fafnir" |
| 02:12 | <&McMartin> | (A, um, giant lumberjack) |
| 02:13 | <&McMartin> | (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Bunyan will probably give more useful backstory than I can) |
| 02:13 | <&McMartin> | (America has very few Actual Legendary Heroes. Bunyan is as close as I can come up with on short notice) |
| 02:15 | <@Reiv> | (Too young, it happens) |
| 02:15 | <@Reiv> | (We have much the same; the closest thing to Legendary Heroes we have is the mythos of No8 Wire, various inventors, and numerous VC winners) |
| 02:15 | <@Reiv> | (Including one that rather ruined a movie script, which was wonderful) |
| 02:15 | <@Reiv> | (But perhaps a tale for another time~) |
| 02:17 | <&McMartin> | (The US equivalent of "Various Inventors" would be people like Davy Crockett or Johnny Appleseed) |
| 02:18 | <&McMartin> | (Paul Bunyan is more the kind that did things like accidentally create the Grand Canyon when his axe handle came loose) |
| 02:18 | <@Reiv> | (... ha, right) |
| 02:18 | <@Reiv> | (... this sounds like it might have started as America's First Chuck Norris Joke) |
| 02:18 | <&McMartin> | (The phrase you are looking for is "tall tales") |
| 02:19 | <@Reiv> | (sssh) |
| 02:19 | <@Reiv> | (memes existed before the internet) |
| 02:19 | <&McMartin> | (Yes, and actually, whether he was an actual piece of folklore or an 18th-century equivalent of Slenderman is still up for debate) |
| 02:27 | <~Vornicus> | No8 Wire? |
| 02:27 | <&McMartin> | A specific kind of wire. |
| 02:28 | <&McMartin> | It is symbolic of jury-rigging stuff to improvise your way out of jams |
| 02:28 | <~Vornicus> | So, like... duct tape |
| 02:28 | <&McMartin> | I think the US equivalent is MacGuyver at this point |
| 02:29 | <~Vornicus> | macgyver; guyver is... something else |
| 02:40 | <@Reiv> | Number 8 wire is a certain size of wire, used in the past for heavier-duty fencing. Flexible enough to be manhandled, stiff enough to actually hold. |
| 02:40 | <@Reiv> | And readily available to farmers. |
| 02:41 | <@Reiv> | Field-expedient repairs, etc |
| 02:42 | <~Vornicus> | yeah, I can see that being useful |
| 02:43 | <@Reiv> | "No.8 wire and baling twine" is an expression of rough-and-ready kiwi ingenuity |
| 02:43 | <&McMartin> | Similar American idioms all seem to involve chewing gum |
| 02:47 | <@Reiv> | How very... american |
| 02:47 | <@Reiv> | Appropriate, really |
| 02:47 | <@Reiv> | In recent-er decades, part of the legend is tied up with the Long Range Desert Group in africa in WWII, a british forerunner-sorta to the SAS |
| 02:48 | <@Reiv> | In which the british ended up specifically recruiting kiwi farmers to be the special forces, as they were deemed to be self-reliant, good with field-expedient repairs, good shots with a gun to start with, etc |
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| 06:20 | <&jeroud> | McMartin: I find the AI War soundtrack to be particularly effective coding music. |
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| 08:38 | <@abudhabi> | Java. What does it mean when a method is declared like: protected <T> T methodName()? |
| 08:43 | <&McMartin> | That's a new one on me. It clearly has something to do with generics but I'm not sure in what way. |
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| 09:00 | <@Azash> | I have no idea and can't find anything with a quick google, but I'll guess protected<T> sets the context for the protected keyword? |
| 09:03 | <@abudhabi> | I think I found it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generics_in_Java#Generic_method_definitions |
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| 10:12 | <@Azash> | Ah |
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| 10:20 | | * TheWatcher readsup, listens to that Magicka track |
| 10:21 | <@TheWatcher> | i lack context, having never played the game, but going off what I do know that's hilariously over-the-top |
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| 10:51 | <@froztbyte> | that's about on-par with the game experience, though |
| 10:51 | <@froztbyte> | because Magicka is made of <3 |
| 10:53 | <@froztbyte> | my only complaint is that it's still not on OSX or Linux |
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| 12:09 | <@gnolam> | ... holy shit Qt's translation support is a godsend |
| 12:16 | < RchrdB> | gnolam: Qt has tranlation support that significantly differs from the gettext() .po, .pot and .mo file mechanism? |
| 12:26 | <&McMartin> | It requires two fewer files~ |
| 12:26 | <&McMartin> | Also you only have to make one call to TranslateUi if you're using the full framework, IIRC. |
| 12:28 | <&McMartin> | (Bias alert: Qt4 is probably overall my favorite widget set. Qt3 isn't powerful enough and Qt5 finally has its ~application framework~ aspects drown the rest of it enough to make it more trouble than its predecessor.) |
| 12:28 | <&McMartin> | (The issue is that even Qt4 isn't a widget set, it is like 3/4 of an operating system) |
| 12:30 | <@TheWatcher> | All it's missing is an emacs widget~ |
| 12:30 | <@Azash> | Emacs, my favourite hypervisor |
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| 12:51 | <@Tarinaky_> | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKg1hTOQXoY&feature=youtu.be&t=23m47s |
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| --- Log closed Fri Nov 07 13:18:21 2014 |
| --- Log opened Fri Nov 07 13:18:26 2014 |
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| 14:01 | < gizmore> | http://pics.nase-bohren.de/version-control.jpg |
| 14:08 | <@TheWatcher> | Would be even more funny if it wasn't jibberish~ |
| 14:12 | < gizmore> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeomorphism |
| 14:12 | < gizmore> | Endofunctor: A functor that maps a category to itself. |
| 14:12 | < gizmore> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilbert_space |
| 14:12 | <@TheWatcher> | Individual words in it are real, sure |
| 14:13 | < gizmore> | i don´t understand the meaning... and i don´t understand git... so for me it´s true |
| 14:13 | < gizmore> | i mean i studied the git manual. several weeks |
| 14:13 | < gizmore> | http://git-man-page-generator.lokaltog.net/ |
| 14:14 | < gizmore> | the jpg above at least gave me an idea! |
| 14:16 | <@TheWatcher> | but you can't map git branches to hilbert spaces, as the former are composed of discrete entities, while hilbert spaces are continuous, homeomorphic mapping of any form would fail |
| 14:16 | <@TheWatcher> | well, be impossible, really |
| 14:16 | <@TheWatcher> | Make no sense |
| 14:16 | < gizmore> | you claim i cannot make git recurse? |
| 14:19 | < gizmore> | thanks for ruining the fun, though! |
| 14:26 | <@iospace> | oh screen, how I love you |
| 14:26 | <@abudhabi> | nofunallowed.jpg |
| 14:38 | | * iospace returns, having found her computer restarted, was able to resume her linux work right away :3 |
| 14:40 | <&ToxicFrog> | ⥠git |
| 14:40 | <&ToxicFrog> | iospace: I've been using tmux-resurrect for that, it's pretty nice. |
| 14:41 | <&ToxicFrog> | Although what would be nicer would be figuring out why everything attached to the UPS has been rebooting every morning. |
| 14:42 | <@iospace> | heh |
| 14:43 | <@iospace> | I haven't figured out tmux, too lazy too and for my purposes on this server, screen works fine |
| 14:43 | <@iospace> | (that, and i have configured the way I like :P) |
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| 14:55 | <@iospace> | Hardcoded passwords in a plaintext file. Absolutely nothing can go wrong with this |
| 15:03 | <@iospace> | https://twitter.com/Guiyaum/status/530644273591746560 truth |
| 15:22 | <&ToxicFrog> | iospace: that was my attitude for a long time, finally just sucked it up and installed tmux and it is a lot nicer. Deals better with simultaneous attachments, works better over slow links, better UI once you sort all the keybindings out. |
| 15:27 | | * iospace thinks she needs moar coffee |
| 15:53 | < Lambo> | iospace, my boss loved that image |
| 15:53 | < Lambo> | lol |
| 15:56 | <@iospace> | ToxicFrog: it still reminds me of blub "oh, use this because it has more powerful features!" and... I'm perfectly fine with screen |
| 15:56 | <@iospace> | it works, gets the job done, etc |
| 15:56 | <&ToxicFrog> | iospace: the whole point of blub is that the more powerful thing is more powerful, but in ways that aren't evident until you use it~ |
| 15:57 | <&ToxicFrog> | That said, I'm not saying that you need to switch to tmux, just that I'm finding it noticeably more pleasant than screen. |
| 15:57 | <@iospace> | ToxicFrog: yes, but on the same hand, blub also has that air of "This is better because reasons", where those reasons are completely arbitrary |
| 15:57 | <&ToxicFrog> | Honestly, I'm not sure I'd describe it as "more powerful", although the plugin system is pretty nice. It's more...polished, perhaps. It does the same things as screen, but better. |
| 15:57 | <@iospace> | like saying Haskell is better than C |
| 15:57 | <&ToxicFrog> | ...what |
| 15:58 | <&ToxicFrog> | Did we read the same blub |
| 15:58 | <@iospace> | maybe, I don't know |
| 15:58 | <@iospace> | I maybe interpreted it differently :P |
| 15:58 | <@iospace> | ToxicFrog: to me, blub represents making "more powerful languages" because of some "deficiency" in another language |
| 15:59 | <@iospace> | while I'm pretty sure that wasn't the author's original intent for it be read like that, that's how I view it |
| 16:00 | <&ToxicFrog> | It wasn't at all. |
| 16:00 | <&ToxicFrog> | The whole point of the essay is that your assessment of programming languages is shaped by the capabilities of the languages you've actually used. |
| 16:00 | | * iospace shrugs |
| 16:00 | <@iospace> | ok |
| 16:01 | <&ToxicFrog> | Languages with capabilities you are unfamiliar with often look like pointless gimmickry until you actually use them and see why they're useful. |
| 16:01 | <@iospace> | well yes, but you also have to consider that those who champion said languages also come across as arrogant and smug |
| 16:01 | <@iospace> | not always, but occasionally yes |
| 16:02 | <&ToxicFrog> | "said languages"? |
| 16:02 | | * iospace shrugs |
| 16:02 | <&ToxicFrog> | You mean Lisp? |
| 16:02 | <@iospace> | haskell, mostly |
| 16:03 | <@iospace> | Haskell is a nice language, but the problem with blub? it doesn't account for the /application/ that the person is coding for. You're not going to use Haskell for a GUI, nor would you use it for embedded |
| 16:03 | <&ToxicFrog> | The original essay doesn't mention Haskell at all and was actually talking about Lisp. |
| 16:04 | <@iospace> | ToxicFrog: yes, but you can replace Lisp with Haskell for modern times |
| 16:04 | <&ToxicFrog> | And, yeah, AFAIK you're reading things into the essay that don't actually exist in it |
| 16:04 | <@iospace> | my bad then |
| 16:04 | <@iospace> | either way |
| 16:04 | <@iospace> | anyway, back to the point I was trying ot make before making silly arguments |
| 16:04 | <@iospace> | still going to use screen :P |
| 16:06 | | * iospace is tired and out of it |
| 16:09 | < Lambo> | <3 screen |
| 16:59 | <@iospace> | http://i.imgur.com/0egYfNW.png |
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| 17:02 | <@Tarinaky_> | Nerds are lazy, and unless programming languages are your particular sub-geekery you'd probably rather spend that energy on whatever your particular sub-geekery is. |
| 17:02 | <@Tarinaky_> | Like graphics shaders or statistics. |
| 17:02 | <@Tarinaky_> | IDK |
| 17:04 | <@Tarinaky_> | Some people are too busy carefully hand-carving beautiful hand-chisel masterpieces to invest the effort in learning how to operate CAD/CAM/CNC technology. |
| 17:04 | <@Tarinaky_> | IDK what my point was. |
| 17:04 | <@Tarinaky_> | Ignore me. |
| 17:04 | <@abudhabi> | /ignore Tarinaky_ |
| 17:05 | <@iospace> | /ignore Tarinaky_ |
| 17:05 | <@Tarinaky_> | iospace: :( |
| 17:05 | <@iospace> | :P |
| 17:06 | <@Tarinaky_> | Things that annoy me on Windows: Ctrl+D doesn't close Cmd.exe |
| 17:23 | <&ToxicFrog> | using cmd.exe is your first mistake~ |
| 17:23 | <@Azash> | s/C.*/*/ |
| 17:28 | < gizmore> | Tarinaky_: if you are going to make a "Things that annoy me on Windows" list, you will get autokicked for flooding |
| 17:29 | <@Azash> | gizmore: Nah he can just control his rate |
| 17:33 | <@Tarinaky_> | gizmore: Things that annoy me on Windows #2: every time you make a "Things that annoy me on Windows" list, you get autokicked for flooding. |
| 17:34 | < gizmore> | #3: Everything except cygwin... well cygwin too |
| 17:34 | <@Tarinaky_> | Cygwin is the worst! |
| 17:34 | <@Tarinaky_> | But it's either that or learning PowerShell. :/ |
| 17:36 | <@Azash> | What happens when developers have to do sales https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAalGQ5LSpA |
| 17:48 | < gizmore> | i wish i got small pizza thingies to my bass riffs |
| 17:54 | <&ToxicFrog> | Tarinaky_: Cygwin at least comes with a windows native port of rxvt |
| 17:55 | <&ToxicFrog> | Also, clearly someone has never used MKS Toolkit |
| 18:02 | <@Tarinaky_> | ToxicFrog: I wasn't implying that one shouldn't use Cygwin or that it isn't otherwise a piece of kit you want to use when you have to use Windows... |
| 18:03 | <&ToxicFrog> | Tarinaky_: no, I was saying that if you're saying Cygwin is The Worst you have clearly never used MKS Toolkit |
| 18:03 | <&ToxicFrog> | Which is Cygwin, except missing 90% of the stuff and expensive. |
| 18:03 | <@Tarinaky_> | Oh, okay. |
| 18:03 | <@Tarinaky_> | I was going for "It's not the best way to travel faster than light, just the only way" kind of remark. |
| 18:04 | < gizmore> | .+quote <@Tarinaky_> I was going for "It's not the best way to travel faster than light, just the only way" kind of remark. |
| 18:19 | <@iospace> | "ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI" |
| 18:21 | < gizmore> | i´ll quote that too |
| 18:24 | <@iospace> | that's from another channel's bod |
| 18:24 | <@iospace> | *bot |
| 18:24 | <@iospace> | so ... recursive botness? |
| 18:24 | < Lambo> | Stop telling me you ACKnowledged something I never told you! Keep it up and my day will get slower |
| 18:25 | | * iospace pats Lambo |
| 18:28 | < gizmore> | iospace: fun fact: a frien did a protocol for inter bot data exchange IBDES |
| 18:28 | < gizmore> | it´s not in use anymore... thank god |
| 18:28 | < Lambo> | gizmore, DCC4lif |
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| 21:31 | <@abudhabi> | Does Java multithreading automatically uses multiple cores if present? |
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| 21:33 | <@abudhabi> | -s |
| 21:34 | <&McMartin> | I don't believe the language specifies that. I strongly suspect that Oracle's version and OpenJDK both do, however. |
| 21:37 | <@abudhabi> | Nice. |
| 21:42 | < gizmore> | "suspect" and "ok thanks" |
| 21:42 | < gizmore> | better ask in #java on freenode |
| 21:43 | <&McMartin> | I've read the JVM spec cover to cover, albeit a few versions back. I'm actually pretty certain it's not *specified*. |
| 21:43 | <&McMartin> | But it was a few versions back, so this might have changed. |
| 21:45 | <@abudhabi> | gizmore: That channel is invite-only, and ##java requires registration. effort.jpg |
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| 21:46 | < gizmore> | thx McMartin |
| 22:01 | <@iospace> | I don't get this code |
| 22:02 | <@iospace> | It checks for a "lockfile", if the lockfile is there, check to see if there's a PID in there. If there is, something is running, if not, something isn't. Why make the differentiation? |
| 22:12 | <@abudhabi> | Lockfile not properly deleted sometimes? |
| 22:12 | <@Tamber> | To make sure it's not a stale lock left behind by an earlier run that didn't clean up properly |
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| --- Log closed Sat Nov 08 00:00:37 2014 |