| --- Log opened Sun Aug 28 00:00:55 2011 |
| 00:09 | < gnolam> | So what's the new project? |
| 00:10 | < Vornicus> | Ooh ooh new project? |
| 00:10 | <@McMartin> | I've been meaning to throw together an SDL physics engine to roughly match the GM8 system. |
| 00:10 | <@McMartin> | If only because I do eventually want to port Hex Inverter. |
| 00:10 | < Vornicus> | Aha |
| 00:11 | < gnolam> | GM8? |
| 00:11 | < gnolam> | Also, why should a physics engine be tied to SDL? :) |
| 00:11 | <@McMartin> | Game Maker 8, a Windows-based game engine |
| 00:11 | <@McMartin> | gnolam: Well, OK, the Sprite object will default to an SDL implementation |
| 00:11 | <@McMartin> | But that's the kind of thing where if you rebind it you should rebind it at compile time, in your makefile |
| 00:12 | <@McMartin> | Also, "physics" is too strong; it's really event loop and forward kinematics |
| 00:16 | <@McMartin> | Anyway, GM8 is more of an engine than, say, RPG Maker is. Iji and Spelunky were written in it |
| 00:17 | <@McMartin> | But it has some annoying shortcomings despite being a decent prototyping tool, so I'm unlikely to ship stuff in it. |
| 00:17 | < Vornicus> | Like what limitations? |
| 00:17 | <@McMartin> | Anything that isn't sprite blitting works terribly slowly on modern graphics cards for some reason. |
| 00:17 | <@McMartin> | No resource overlays |
| 00:18 | <@McMartin> | (So it has to load all resources at once into RAM at program start) |
| 00:18 | < Vornicus> | Resource overla... ah |
| 00:18 | <@McMartin> | And while it has objects, those objects are not easy to make standalone. |
| 00:19 | <@McMartin> | Finally, of course, you're constrained to Windows. |
| 00:19 | <@McMartin> | http://mcmartin.livejournal.com/125009.html includes my much more detailed runthrough of the system and what I think of it, back when I first started investigating it. |
| 00:19 | <@McMartin> | Even after working through a reasonably major project in it, I stand by these conclusions. |
| 00:20 | <@McMartin> | (The short form is "If you're on Windows and just want to write stuff, this is almost certainly what you want to use because any other alternative will involve dealing with a bunch of stuff you don't actually want to be doing") |
| 00:21 | <@McMartin> | (If you're skilled at this stuff, it offers little, but can be a handy prototyping tool) |
| 00:24 | < Vornicus> | Since I don't know how to do most of "this stuff" GM8 looks good to me. |
| 00:24 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2 |
| 00:26 | <@McMartin> | I don't expect I'd do a complete reimplementation, but I'd like to have enough kinematics to be able to have a platformer core. |
| 00:29 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
| 00:32 | <@McMartin> | Vornicus: And yeah, on that list, I'd say the sound mixer and the resource bundling are the two hardest things. |
| 00:32 | <@McMartin> | There are other nice bonuses - there's a Bezier-curve and timeline-based space-and-time scripting engine, for instance - but those are things I wouldn't consider to be Mandatory Additions to a core engine. |
| 00:33 | <@McMartin> | Oh, right |
| 00:33 | <@McMartin> | The viewports could be tricky depending on what you had underlying it. |
| 00:34 | < Vornicus> | My graphics programming skill is essentially 0. My current best is "programs that write postscript" |
| 00:40 | < Vornicus> | So I would kind of have to depend on a crutch like GM8 to write anything because I've never done, well, any of that engine shit. |
| 00:40 | <@McMartin> | Yeah |
| 00:41 | <@McMartin> | And actually, reading the manual for a lot of this is kind of motivation-sapping~ |
| 00:41 | < Vornicus> | Heh. |
| 00:41 | <@McMartin> | What I should be doing if I want instant gratification is to write a graphical picker for touchscreens in Java and then port Hex Inverter to *that* |
| 00:41 | <@McMartin> | So that it will run on my phone. |
| 00:50 | | * Vornicus wishes the GM8 mindstorms interface wrote straight to code, that'd be nice. |
| 00:50 | <@McMartin> | Yeah |
| 00:50 | <@McMartin> | I've become a bit more skeptical about using Mindstorms by choice; if you can get away with all GML all the time you basically should. |
| 00:51 | <@McMartin> | Oh, right, that's the other big thing GM8 is lacking: multithreading |
| 00:53 | < Vornicus> | WHich I am for damn sure not writing myself anyway! |
| 00:53 | <@McMartin> | I needed to basically write continuations in GML for Hex Inverter so that it wouldn't lock the application while considering its move. =( |
| 00:53 | <@McMartin> | From an architecture standpoint, it's a framestep/update system with a publish-subscribe model for events |
| 00:54 | <@McMartin> | Where events can be user inputs or things like object-to-object collisions. |
| 00:55 | <@McMartin> | Actually, yeah. That is what I should do. |
| 00:55 | <@McMartin> | I should port Hex Inverter - or at least what I have of it - to C++. |
| 00:55 | <@McMartin> | I've already rewritten the AI in C++ because I needed to do that to tune it. |
| 00:56 | <@McMartin> | Its sound requirements are presently nonexistent and will never be beyond the ability of SDL_mixer to handle. |
| 00:56 | <@McMartin> | I do still need a spriter for the piece animations, though. |
| 00:59 | <@McMartin> | Oh, duh |
| 00:59 | <@McMartin> | I just realized that duplicating the GM8 picker trick is way easier than writing an "honest" hex picker. |
| 01:00 | <@McMartin> | I can just have a sprite object for each hex, and when I get "there was a click at window coordinate X, Y" I can ask each sprite "hey, when you draw yourself, do you put an opaque pixel at X, Y?" |
| 01:00 | <@McMartin> | And that answer will be "yes" for at most one hex. At which point I have my coordinate. |
| 01:02 | | * McMartin blinks |
| 01:02 | <@McMartin> | I take back a great deal of what I just said. |
| 01:02 | <@McMartin> | The next version of Game Maker will target HTML5/JS as an output engine. |
| 01:02 | < Vornicus> | Man. |
| 01:02 | <@McMartin> | That, uh, solves a whole lot of portability concerns. |
| 01:03 | <@ToxicFrog> | o.O |
| 01:04 | <@McMartin> | http://yoyogames.com/gamemaker/html5 |
| 01:04 | <@McMartin> | I'll probably make an SDL version of Hex Inverter anyway... |
| 01:04 | <@McMartin> | ... but I think I'll be keeping the GM8 version up to date. |
| 01:11 | <@McMartin> | (Also, I do recommend They Need To Be Fed; it's a fun little platformer~) |
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| --- Log closed Sun Aug 28 01:37:12 2011 |
| --- Log opened Sun Aug 28 01:43:05 2011 |
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| 01:55 | <@McMartin> | Oh hey, and I also have a free upgrade pending |
| 01:55 | | * McMartin gets right on that. |
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| --- Log closed Sun Aug 28 09:53:29 2011 |
| --- Log opened Sun Aug 28 09:53:37 2011 |
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| 15:00 | | * Reiver pokes at his math, hmms |
| 15:01 | < Reiver> | So, I think I hit a slightly odd bit of math on my system, but I'm trying to decide if it's significant or not. Anyone here good with probability able to help me out? |
| 15:01 | < Reiver> | The question is long enough I'd rather ask first, for a change, given that my beloved Vorn isn't here to help me like normal. ;) |
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| --- Log closed Mon Aug 29 00:00:09 2011 |