| --- Log opened Sat Jul 30 00:00:58 2011 |
| 00:15 | | AnnoDomini [annodomini@Nightstar-e3cfc00c.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [[NS] Quit: leaving] |
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| 10:31 | < AnnoDomini> | http://thereifixedit.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/white-trash-repairs-in-brillian t-colors.jpg |
| 11:23 | | * gnolam WTFs at Python. |
| 11:24 | < gnolam> | What on Earth makes you think that you can only print 7-bit ASCII? >:E |
| 11:30 | <@Vornicus> | It assumes no encoding. |
| 11:31 | <@Vornicus> | Or rather: it appears to think that your console is 7-bit ascii, possibly because it can't tell otherwise. |
| 11:50 | | Attilla [Some.Dude@Nightstar-f29f718d.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #code |
| 12:15 | | * Reiver wonders. Even vaugely legit? |
| 12:16 | <~Reiver> http://i.imgur.com/CNy9J.jpg |
| 12:19 | < AnnoDomini> | This DOES look like a formula for a circle-like thing. |
| 12:39 | | Kindamoody|out is now known as Kindamoody |
| 12:45 | | * TheWatcher would try it, but his calculator is currently batteryless, and while he has matlab around, does not have it installed |
| 14:21 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[afk] |
| 14:40 | < gnolam> | ... try saying "monoenergetic electron energy threshold" three times fast. |
| 14:42 | | Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody|nap |
| 15:01 | | * froztbyte ponders a quick installation of R or gnuplot to try that out |
| 15:01 | <@froztbyte> | the formula doesn't use any crazy functions, so my basic grasp of R and gnuplot should be sufficient |
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| 16:31 | < gnolam> | Hmm. How much overhead does the Function in Yellow have? |
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| 18:11 | < gnolam> | Mmm, wxPython's documentation... |
| 18:11 | < gnolam> | "Control __init__(self, parent, id, pos, size, style, validator, name) |
| 18:11 | < gnolam> | Create a Control." |
| 18:11 | < gnolam> | The actual definition: |
| 18:11 | < gnolam> | __init__(self, parent, id=-1, value=EmptyString, pos=DefaultPosition, size=DefaultSize, style=0, validator=DefaultValidator, name=TextCtrlNameStr) |
| 18:16 | < gnolam> | Tell me something: in docs that are clearly autogenerated with a minimal amount of extra information, how the fuck do you miss an entire constructor argument? |
| 18:17 | <@Namegduf> | Add it after the generation? |
| 18:37 | | * gnolam also stabs wxPython for its ass backwards bind order. |
| 18:37 | < gnolam> | Apparently, the /last/ control to bind is the first to get the event. :P |
| 18:41 | < gnolam> | Think you can save yourself a ton of work and code by subclassing a control, binding to whatever its "OH HAI I HAS NEW VALUE" event is, and filtering said events so only /valid/ values get passed on? Computer says no. |
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| 20:56 | | * gnolam stabs it again, for good measure, then takes off and nukes it from orbit. |
| 20:56 | < gnolam> | RAEG |
| 21:04 | < AnnoDomini> | All of your hate? |
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| 21:17 | < gnolam> | All of my hate what? :P |
| 21:23 | < AnnoDomini> | Just all of your hate. |
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| 22:21 | <@McMartin> | "Emacs: Fangorn. Vast, ancient, gnarled and mostly impenetrable, tended by a small band of ancient shepherds old as the world itself, under the command of their leader, Neckbeard. They possess unbelievable strength, are infuriatingly slow, and their land is entirely devoid of women." |
| 22:25 | < gnolam> | :) |
| 22:27 | < gnolam> | But there's another guaranteed rage-inducer. Emacs. |
| 22:28 | < gnolam> | I just don't understand what people see in it. Other than "it tends to be available" and "works over remote X", I have found no redeeming qualities about it. |
| 22:29 | < gnolam> | It's needlessly complicated, its default options and keybindings are shite, and its syntax highlighting is both slow and buggy. |
| 22:30 | < gnolam> | Oh, and the GNU indent style is horrible. :P |
| 22:33 | < kwsn> | o rly |
| 22:33 | < Rhamphoryncus> | I like to compare emacs to notepad.. and give notepad the win |
| 22:36 | < AnnoDomini> | Notepad is pretty pimp. In WinXP and onwards, they added the Ctrl+S combination to save! |
| 22:37 | < Rhamphoryncus> | heh |
| 22:37 | < Rhamphoryncus> | Can you do that in emacs? |
| 22:38 | < AnnoDomini> | I don't know. I don't use emacs. |
| 22:41 | < kwsn> | i use :w to save |
| 22:43 | < AnnoDomini> | That looks like a mutant smiley. |
| 22:44 | < Stalker> | Anno: Notepad always saved on ctrl+s? |
| 22:45 | < AnnoDomini> | No. |
| 22:45 | < AnnoDomini> | The earlier versions don't have this. |
| 22:51 | <@McMartin> | In emacs, it's Ctrl-X S. |
| 22:52 | <@McMartin> | Emacs and Notepad do have one extremely unfortunate command clash, though. |
| 22:52 | <@McMartin> | "Beginning of Line" in Emacs is "Select All so as to replace it" in Notepad. |
| 22:53 | <@McMartin> | More seriously, emacs is a generic IDE, not a text editor, and while GNU indentation is retarded, fixing it permanently is less work than making your editor turn tabs into spaces is in most other ones. |
| 22:54 | <@McMartin> | (And if you're programming in almost any language but C, C++, Java, or NSIS script, emacs is your only real hope.) |
| 22:54 | <@McMartin> | If you're on Windows, emacs isn't very useful. Aquamacs for Mac is very solid and actually puts in all the standard Mac accelerators so you can use it like that. |
| 22:55 | <@McMartin> | If you're on Windows, if you aren't using Notepad++, you're probably missing out. |
| 22:56 | <@Namegduf> | Eh? |
| 22:56 | <@Namegduf> | Tabs to spaces has never been hard in any editor I've used but possibly nano. |
| 22:58 | <@McMartin> | Not "tabs to spaces" |
| 22:58 | <@McMartin> | "press tab, get spaces". |
| 22:59 | <@Namegduf> | Yes, that's not been hard in any editor I've ever used. |
| 22:59 | <@Namegduf> | Vim has an option for it, traditionally used for Python in particular |
| 22:59 | <@McMartin> | Notepad came up. It is entirely incapable of this. |
| 22:59 | <@Namegduf> | Yes, but you said "in most other ones". |
| 22:59 | <@McMartin> | Entirely too few windows and mac-based editors have it as an option at all, unless they are explicitly designed as IDE components. |
| 22:59 | <@Namegduf> | I've had more trouble turning that OFF than finding it |
| 22:59 | <@Namegduf> | Ah, Windows-based. |
| 22:59 | <@Namegduf> | You could be right. |
| 23:00 | <@Namegduf> | Also Mac-based. |
| 23:00 | <@Namegduf> | I know little for either. |
| 23:00 | <@McMartin> | People complaining about emacs's usability concerns are not likely to be vi partisans~ |
| 23:00 | <@Namegduf> | nano can do it. |
| 23:00 | <@Namegduf> | -E |
| 23:01 | <@McMartin> | Oh hey. |
| 23:01 | <@McMartin> | Good to know. |
| 23:01 | <@Namegduf> | Yeah, I had to check, mostly because I thought it might have been default. |
| 23:01 | <@Namegduf> | I hate tabs to spaces (I prefer languages where it's not a common thing most of the time), and keep being annoyed by things which do it. |
| 23:01 | <@McMartin> | That means nano is now usable for throwing together tiny Python scripts for me, hooray~ |
| 23:02 | <@McMartin> | My problem is that I prefer tab stops of size 4, and the rest of the world keeps pretending not to while they totally do. |
| 23:02 | <@McMartin> | Spaces keep the world safe. |
| 23:02 | <@Namegduf> | That's a good point, although since it uses eight spaces by default you're worse off for standards than using tab. |
| 23:02 | <@Namegduf> | (Because tab can more easily be search and replaced) |
| 23:03 | <@McMartin> | nano -E -T 4 |
| 23:03 | <@Namegduf> | Aha. |
| 23:03 | <@Namegduf> | It is good, yes |
| 23:03 | <@McMartin> | In fact, I shuold probably just make that an alias~ |
| 23:05 | <@Namegduf> | I like tabs because I work in variable sized terminals, and thus like to be able to adjust the size of visible indents as a display parameter. Plus I find it conceptually unpleasant in the same way using <br /> and in HTML is compared to <p>, or <b> vs <h4> |
| 23:05 | <@Namegduf> | But it is a holy war and the important thing is to go with whatever anyone else is using, so in Python that means spaces. |
| 23:06 | <@Namegduf> | Four thereof. |
| 23:07 | <@Namegduf> | I once saw a Vim style that rendered tabs as "--->" |
| 23:07 | <@Namegduf> | So you'd see --->--->--->something; |
| 23:07 | <@Namegduf> | It was nicer with the original colours; the ---> was dark blue on black, so it was subtle. |
| 23:08 | <@Namegduf> | I like being able to do that kind of thing. |
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| 23:21 | < gnolam> | I disregard the "use spaces" rule of Python and just use tabs like a sane person. :P |
| 23:29 | <@McMartin> | The Python rule is actually "don't mix tabs and spaces" |
| 23:30 | <@Namegduf> | That's the everything rule |
| 23:30 | <@Namegduf> | Well, no |
| 23:30 | <@McMartin> | Python's is stricter than the everything rule, IIRC. |
| 23:30 | <@McMartin> | Python dislikes rendering three tabstops as one tab, four spaces, too, I think |
| 23:31 | <@Namegduf> | http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/ <- I was referring to this. |
| 23:31 | <@McMartin> | aha |
| 23:31 | <@McMartin> | Yeah |
| 23:32 | <@McMartin> | Python is unusually ideologically unified |
| 23:32 | <@Namegduf> | I should clarify that I was only referring to indents, alignment should always be via spaces. |
| 23:32 | <@McMartin> | That's a trick far too few editors know -_- |
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| --- Log closed Sun Jul 31 00:00:12 2011 |