| --- Log opened Mon Apr 12 00:00:54 2010 |
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| 03:53 | <@Derakon> | Using genetic algorithms to beat Air Man from Mega Man 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7xJNAJys2s |
| 03:55 | | * Derakon goes off to make dinner. |
| 03:55 | | Derakon is now known as Derakon[AFK] |
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| 05:17 | <@Kazriko> | Hmm. Eclipse doesn't play completely nice with ubuntu. At least the restart function. |
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| 07:55 | <@Kazriko> | Bah, not just restarting, but exiting too. It doesn't unload from memory when you close it. |
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| 09:25 | | mode/#code [+o AnnoDomini] by Reiver |
| 09:52 | <@AnnoDomini> | Okay, so I'm trying to install the nvidia drivers, according to these instructions: http://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers#Installation |
| 09:53 | <@AnnoDomini> | How do I make sure that apt has the contrib and non-free sources? I've added a line pretty much straight out of the man pages, but I'm unsure that's it. |
| 10:14 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| 10:26 | < Tarinaky> | Uhh... Isn't nonfree sources a contradiction in terms? |
| 10:26 | < Tarinaky> | At least wrt drivers. |
| 10:27 | <@McMartin> | No |
| 10:27 | <@McMartin> | You can have source available and still violate the OSD. |
| 10:27 | < Tarinaky> | Aren't nonfree graphics drivers the vendor released ones... |
| 10:27 | < Tarinaky> | The ones where the source code is a trade secret that details the inner workings of the graphics card... |
| 10:28 | < Tarinaky> | The ones only available as binary unless you sign an NDA and are thus allowed to peek at a limited subset of the source. |
| 10:29 | <@McMartin> | Part of it is always available; the shim has to be custom-compiled against each kernel |
| 10:29 | <@McMartin> | And that part is in fact actually open source, IIRC. |
| 10:29 | <@McMartin> | Debian repos have "non-free" sections that you can ask it to search, since apt-based installs are normally just of binaries. |
| 10:30 | < Namegduf> | "sources" refers to a package source, not source code. |
| 10:30 | < Tarinaky> | Ah. |
| 10:30 | < Namegduf> | But, yes, you can have source available and said code not be free. |
| 10:30 | < Namegduf> | "I'll give you this code, but you can't redistribute it or use it for anything." is not free. |
| 10:33 | <@McMartin> | Ghostscript used to basically do this. |
| 10:34 | <@McMartin> | It's been properly GPL for awhile now though |
| 10:36 | < Tarinaky> | And UNIX itself shipped source code with the academic/education version so I've read. |
| 10:41 | <@McMartin> | The UNIX situation was so bad that when the inevitable lawsuit came they both looked so bad they sealed the record and mutually agreed to never speak of it again |
| 10:42 | <@McMartin> | It was finally unsealed two years ago when SCO decided it wanted to relitigate it by being smashed into a tiny paste by IBM and Novell simultaneously. |
| 10:43 | <@AnnoDomini> | So, uh, yeah. Does adding "deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian stable main contrib non-free" validate the stipulation that I should have contrib and non-free stuff enabled, in conforming with the guide? |
| 10:43 | <@McMartin> | That looks vaguely right, but it's been a long time; I'll defer to the others if they're here, otherwise it's probably worth an experiment. |
| 10:43 | <@McMartin> | But I have to crash out now. |
| 10:44 | <@AnnoDomini> | (This is a direct copy/paste from the man pages.) |
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| 12:14 | <@AnnoDomini> | For some reason, it's not finding the nvidia-kernel-common package. |
| 12:14 | <@AnnoDomini> | I mean, apt. |
| 12:21 | <@AnnoDomini> | Nevermind. Just needed to run update. |
| 12:30 | | cpux is now known as shade_of_cpux |
| 12:42 | <@AnnoDomini> | Awright, let's try this. |
| 12:50 | <@AnnoDomini> | It seems that I've fucked up my language and keyboard settings. |
| 12:59 | <@AnnoDomini> | Damn it. I can't seem to fix the settings from the graphical interface, and I'm pretty sure I corrected xorg.conf to be correct. |
| 13:02 | <@AnnoDomini> | Hmm. According to the logs, it isn't reading the stuff I wrote, for some reason. |
| 13:04 | <@AnnoDomini> | Reverting to the old config file fixes the problem. Hmm. |
| 13:06 | | gnolam [lenin@Nightstar-38637aa0.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #code |
| 13:26 | <@AnnoDomini> | Finally. |
| 13:27 | | * AnnoDomini wonders how to log out of this console, without turning irssi off. |
| 13:28 | <@AnnoDomini> | Just running the screened irssi launcher produces a window that can't really be resized. |
| 13:29 | | * AnnoDomini pokes the jerith. |
| 13:30 | <@jerith> | Screen windows can be resized. |
| 13:30 | <@jerith> | Start screen, then start irssi. |
| 13:31 | <@jerith> | Without screen, you can't take the terminal away from it. |
| 13:31 | <@AnnoDomini> | irssi doesn't get resized, though the terminal screen does. |
| 13:31 | <@AnnoDomini> | The problem here is that I'm having access through two terminals. |
| 13:31 | <@AnnoDomini> | I want to turn one off so its settings won't interfere with the other. |
| 13:32 | <@AnnoDomini> | The problem is that it's a text-only console, rather than a window in the graphical environment. |
| 13:33 | <@jerith> | Two terminals? |
| 13:33 | <@jerith> | Howso? |
| 13:33 | <@AnnoDomini> | I was working on changing graphics drivers. I used a text console to connect to the screen session. |
| 13:34 | <@AnnoDomini> | Now that one is still up, but I've also a terminal here, in the GUI. |
| 13:34 | <@jerith> | Ah, you're using screen -x? |
| 13:34 | <@jerith> | Use "screen -rD" instead. |
| 13:35 | <@jerith> | It'll disconnect the other one and give you one here. |
| 13:35 | <@AnnoDomini> | Right-o. |
| 13:35 | <@AnnoDomini> | Mission accomplished. |
| 13:35 | <@AnnoDomini> | Thank you. |
| 13:36 | <@jerith> | You're welcome. |
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| 15:22 | <@jerith> | http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/251 -- A very hacky diceroll chart generator, put together for a discussion in #dnd. |
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| 15:58 | | * gnolam sighs. |
| 15:58 | < gnolam> | Sometimes I wonder if people think at all before designing file formats. |
| 16:01 | <@jerith> | Usually they don't. |
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| 17:01 | < Bobsentme> | derp derp *smacks forehead* |
| 17:02 | < Bobsentme> | Of course a relative link won't work. I'm in Javascript and there is no such file on my computer called "e:\Preferences.txt" >.> |
| 19:46 | < Rhamphoryncus> | heh |
| 19:46 | <@McMartin> | welp |
| 19:46 | <@McMartin> | On the plus side, you have now identified the bug |
| 19:47 | <@McMartin> | gnolam: I know of maybe three file formats that were actually thoughtfully designed |
| 19:47 | <@McMartin> | One of them was PNG |
| 19:47 | <@McMartin> | The others are variants on XML and IFF. =P |
| 19:47 | < Rhamphoryncus> | IFF? |
| 19:49 | <@McMartin> | A metaformat designed originally for Amiga stuff that is also the basis for TIFF, AIFF, and WAV |
| 19:49 | <@McMartin> | Basically, if you're designing a binary format, it should at least look like an IFF or its little-endian equivalent. |
| 19:50 | <@McMartin> | PNG takes it as an inspiration but doesn't quite go for full compliance. |
| 19:58 | < Rhamphoryncus> | ah |
| 20:00 | | Thaqui [Thaqui@27B34E.D54D49.F53FA1.6A113C] has joined #code |
| 20:01 | < Rhamphoryncus> | "Chunks must begin on even file offsets, as befits the origins of IFF on the Motorola 68000 processor, which couldn't address quantities larger than a byte on odd addresses. Thus a chunk following an odd-length chunk will be preceded by a pad byte." |
| 20:01 | < Rhamphoryncus> | I'm gonna say avoiding full compliance was the right choice ;) |
| 20:03 | <@McMartin> | There's also a big pile of chunks you're supposed to always be able to understand, like (c) and ANNO, which I think PNG does not use, or at least not directly. |
| 20:03 | <@McMartin> | PNG also includes several text-mode EOF characters and a \n to check for stuff being trashed by improper file transfers. |
| 20:04 | < Rhamphoryncus> | The 4 byte type is pretty archaic for something used as a generic storage scheme too |
| 20:04 | <@McMartin> | This allows you 4 billion different types. |
| 20:04 | <@McMartin> | At the top level. |
| 20:04 | < Rhamphoryncus> | If centrally registered |
| 20:04 | <@McMartin> | Which they aren't |
| 20:05 | < Rhamphoryncus> | Chose them randomly and you've got a 50% chance of collision at half that width, only 2**16 |
| 20:05 | < Rhamphoryncus> | Nevermind if you use only A-Z |
| 20:06 | <@McMartin> | A-Za-x1-9 and space, normally. |
| 20:06 | < Rhamphoryncus> | 0-9 ;) |
| 20:06 | <@McMartin> | Which means you reserve, if you were serious about making it a standard, which you aren't because XML exists, an extension with FORMEXTF which begins with a chunk that's an arbitrary length string. |
| 20:07 | < Rhamphoryncus> | That puts you up to.. 3969 to get a 50% chance of collision |
| 20:07 | <@McMartin> | You shouldn't have more than a thousand~ |
| 20:07 | < Rhamphoryncus> | Why? Why not just change your underlying format? |
| 20:07 | <@McMartin> | Because if you're serious about keeping a standard around you want it to be readable more or less by generic tools. |
| 20:08 | < Rhamphoryncus> | That's only for existing formats. New formats should use a cleaned up version |
| 20:08 | <@McMartin> | New formats don't show up as regularly as you seem to think. |
| 20:09 | < Rhamphoryncus> | I don't think we're on the same wavelength |
| 20:09 | <@McMartin> | Clearly not. |
| 20:09 | <@McMartin> | You're saying IFF didn't obviate the need for XML, effectively, which nobody is saying. |
| 20:09 | < Rhamphoryncus> | All I'm saying is that if I were the one who designed PNG I wouldn't have used IFF either |
| 20:11 | < Rhamphoryncus> | There are no generic IFF tools that have a meaningful application to PNG, at least not that I can imagine |
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| 20:18 | < Rhamphoryncus> | Looks like PNG is just A-Z. It's case insensitive, with the case bit encoding other information |
| 20:19 | < Rhamphoryncus> | well, sort of case sensitive. It looks like a given chunk type always has the same case bits |
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| 23:05 | | * Derakon eyes his to-do list for this week, which includes investigating how Windows detects when a network connection is/is not available, to make certain it isn't wasting precious CPU cycles on our brand-new top-of-the-line 4-processor behemoth of a computer. |
| 23:07 | < Tarinaky> | Given there's a little light on the back of the NIC that changes colour when the cable is plugged in I think it's hardware :/ |
| 23:07 | < Tarinaky> | But I'm only guessing. |
| 23:08 | <@Derakon> | Yeah, that's what I'm assuming -- plugging in a cable and/or getting a signal along the cable triggers a hardware interrupt. |
| 23:08 | <@Derakon> | But I'd need evidence for this stance. |
| 23:08 | <@Derakon> | (Ideally, evidence that doesn't rely on a physical plug-in, since we're not plugging/unplugging cables from the back of the computer, but from a separate point) |
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| 23:36 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 23:42 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
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| --- Log closed Tue Apr 13 00:00:55 2010 |